Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

[james4321]

.... the policies are hated by the community ......

Thats a bit of a sweeping statement ... sounds just like those slogans that Abbott keeps using (more words though !!)

 

[drsmithy]

There is this very cynical thought I am having.Hoping that Kevin Rudd actually wins the election.Then as the economy comes crashing down and the knives come out we see the demise of the ALP.

I've been thinking the same thing of the Liberals for a year - nearly all the core problems are of Howard & Costello's making, after all, so it only seems appropriate that their idolaters should get to play the endgame.

Reap what ye sowed, and all that.

 

[Mak404matt]

Thats a bit of a sweeping statement ... sounds just like those slogans that Abbott keeps using (more words though !!)

I'm kind of curious as to what policies are hated?

Most people are behind a carbon price, like Gonski, like the NDIS and want the NBN in its current form..

Admittedly the Asylum Seeker policy needs a bit of work, but no mater what, any policy isn't going to please everyone.

 

[Pushka]

Asylum seeker policy. Right. Lets have a policy that says we will process off site in Timor but not even seek to consult with that country's Leaders. Lets process people in Malaysia where even I agreed with the Greens.

NBN. Our area isn't even on the 2017 list.

NDIS - agreed. But it's only half funded; doesn't kick in in SA until 2017 and then only for children. Many of those who could benefit will have died in that time.

Pink Batts.

Gonski. Lets throw money at a system that has had more money thrown at it than other equivalent countries while standards continue to slip. The harder question is why are our standards slipping? Lets look at teacher quality but hey ho, the Unions would hate that.

I'll let others continue but if you'd read this thread from the start they have been listed throughout.

 

[amaroo]

Thats a bit of a sweeping statement ... sounds just like those slogans that Abbott keeps using (more words though !!)

Usually, if you have good policies - you have good poll numbers and you don't sack the PM.

Strange, but true

 

[Mak404matt]

Asylum seeker policy. Right. Lets have a policy that says we will process off site in Timor but not even seek to consult with that country's Leaders. Lets process people in Malaysia where even I agreed with the Greens.

NBN. Our area isn't even on the 2017 list.

NDIS - agreed. But it's only half funded; doesn't kick in in SA until 2017 and then only for children. Many of those who could benefit will have died in that time.

Pink Batts.

Gonski. Lets throw money at a system that has had more money thrown at it than other equivalent countries while standards continue to slip. The harder question is why are our standards slipping? Lets look at teacher quality but hey ho, the Unions would hate that.

I'll let others continue but if you'd read this thread from the start they have been listed throughout.

Re. NBN though, do you not agree that it is worth doing something? We can't run off copper lines forever, and as the country is so big, of course the roll out will be slow.

NDIS - I also agree that it is taking too long to kick in!

Pink Batts - No contest there, a major screwup!

Gonski - I don't have insider knowledge of the industry, but many friends and family do, and are saying that from what they have seen, it will allow smaller classes and more specialist teachers, which you would imagine would increase standards?

Edit: May I also say I love this civil political debate, great to see what the other side of politics thinks! So thanks to Pushka, Skyring, DrRon and others

 

[Pushka]

I'm not convinced the nbn is the best way to go given the speed. By the time we get it, it will be outdated. We don't even have a date yet. But yes the principle is there.

As far as Gonski, I think that we need to listen to people who don't stand to benefit from the money being splashed around. ie teachers and Unions.

I think perhaps a lot of heat has gone with Gillard. My thoughts are that she was incredibly divisive. I can actually envisage a future with the current Govt eek now that the intense influence of the Unions has dissipated somewhat.

 

[Skyring]

Hmmm... He's not a stupid man though and blind Freddie could tell he's on his absolute last chance, so he's got absolutely nothing to lose by making hard decisions, and certainly nothing to gain by squibbing at all...

I think it'll be a very interesting few weeks....

Too right, interesting!

To do better than last time, he'll have to change his style. The fact that he undermined Gillard and forced a showdown in the last few days of Parliament tells me he hasn't changed. I could recognise a change in style. He would have more love in him.

Is it in him to make hard decisions? Only to announce them. He doesn't actually do anything. He calls on the public service to do research and provide reports overnight and then does nothing. He makes a pretty speech and nothing happens.

 

[Skyring]

That's funny. I think the same about Rudd. He just can't help himself.

Now this is good news from Gillard:
http://www.news.com.au/national-new...86-slashed-to-12/story-fnii5s3x-1226671939686

On this, I go with Gillard over Abbott. An unplanned pregnancy can have a major impact, but the impact is disproportionately on the mother.

When children are wanted and loved, the better it is for both parents and children.

We aren't anywhere close to the political cough on abortion we see in the USA, and I'd like to resist any step in that direction.

 

[Skyring]

There is this very cynical thought I am having.Hoping that Kevin Rudd actually wins the election.Then as the economy comes crashing down and the knives come out we see the demise of the ALP.

i don't really care what party is in power. It's not important. It's like caring about which team wins the grand final.

The economy, on the other hand, drives our communal security and happiness. If we have money for health, education, infrastructure, defence and all the civilisation that government brings, then we all do well.

 

[Pushka]

I agree with that Skyring. I don't care which party is in power as long as they are competent and respect that they are spending our money when making decisions. I enjoyed Keatings government; it was tough but competent. Howard needed to hand over the reigns earlier so in the end I wasn't surprised to see him gone. Well, perhaps a little.

 

[joeymelb]

i don't really care what party is in power. It's not important. It's like caring about which team wins the grand final.

The economy, on the other hand, drives our communal security and happiness. If we have money for health, education, infrastructure, defence and all the civilisation that government brings, then we all do well.

I second the sentiment. Regardless of the parties, the driving factor for me is the team and policies behind the leader. I have serious reservation on TA and Hockey at their economic/accountancy credentials... however, compare to Rudd and Bowen (borrow on credit to SPEND, going heavily into debt)...

Personally, I believe Rudd and his team should win the next election. Australian economy is tethering on the cliff. Rudd's reign is what the economy needs to push over that cliff and totally be smashed thru spending and debt. Then a strong Coalition (or a NEW/competent Labor) can come in and rebuild from the ashes without the burden of "promises" that can't be funded. (Like end of John Cain/Joan Kirner where Victorian economy was at rock bottom... then Kennett was able to rebuild the house without the white ants).

Note: I am voting for Labor because Rudd's potential wrecking ball works to my financial benefit.

 

[drron]

I see you have the same voice in the head as I.

 

[drsmithy]

I'm not convinced the nbn is the best way to go given the speed. By the time we get it, it will be outdated.

No, it won't.

Unless you know of some technology the whole comms industry does not, that's going to "outdate" fibre-optics ?

As far as Gonski, I think that we need to listen to people who don't stand to benefit from the money being splashed around. ie teachers and Unions.

Right. Because if there's one group of people who know nothing about how educating children could be done better, it's teachers.

Tell me, do you apply the same logic across the board, and argue we should ignore business owners when it comes to creating economic and labour policy ?

 

[drron]

No, it won't.

Unless you know of some technology the whole comms industry does not, that's going to "outdate" fibre-optics ?


Right. Because if there's one group of people who know nothing about how educating children could be done better, it's teachers.

Tell me, do you apply the same logic across the board, and argue we should ignore business owners when it comes to creating economic and labour policy ?

Well the ALP does.

 

[Pushka]

Right. Because if there's one group of people who know nothing about how educating children could be done better, it's teachers.

Tell me, do you apply the same logic across the board, and argue we should ignore business owners when it comes to creating economic and labour policy ?

If that was the case then why are our education standards falling?

Business owners are ignored in economic policy.

 

[drsmithy]

Well the ALP does.

Only the psychopaths who think people should be working for a couple of bucks a day.

 

[Pushka]

Only the psychopaths who think people should be working for a couple of bucks a day.

Spoken like a true Union man. Bosses are the devil.

 

[drron]

Only the psychopaths who think people should be working for a couple of bucks a day.

You have proof do you?

 

[drsmithy]

If that was the case then why are our education standards falling?

What ?

Business owners are ignored in economic policy.

Heh, funny.