Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

[drsmithy]

hahaha not the last one.

Yes, they did.

Heck, even The Australian says so.

 

[moa999]

And the Labor Govt put in a tax by that very definition, something that wasn't market linked - very much against what Julia said in that policy.

 

[drsmithy]

And they put in a tax by that very definition, something that wasn't market linked.

Actually, they put in a market-linked carbon price with an initial fixed-price term.

 

[amaroo]

Yes, they did.

Geez - you're better than this

 

[moa999]

Actually, they put in a market-linked carbon price with an initial fixed-price term.

You mean they put in a fixed price TAX after a deal with the devil (greens), with some concept to go to an undefined market in the future. Now that the European market is non-functioning (ie such a cheap price that the polluters aren't encouraged to change) and Australian industry is penalised by the TAX, Rudd pulls forward the switch to a market basis, which will mean almost no disencentives for polluters.

The reality is the GFC has done far more for the environment than any govt policy.

 

[Pukka]

Please elaborate on this "greater than 10%" effect and how it might work.

"I don't rule out the possibility of legislating a Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme, a market-based mechanism," she said of the next parliament. "I rule out a carbon tax."
This is the strongest message Ms Gillard has sent about action on carbon pricing.
While any carbon price would not be triggered until after the 2013 election, Ms Gillard would have two potential legislative partners next term - the Coalition or the Greens. She would legislate the carbon price next term if sufficient consensus existed.

So the Greens basically twisted her arm then

 

[drsmithy]

You mean they put in a fixed price TAX after a deal with the devil (greens), with some concept to go to an undefined market in the future. Now that the European market is non-functioning (ie such a cheap price that the polluters aren't encouraged to change) and Australian industry is penalised by the TAX, Rudd pulls forward the switch to a market basis, which will mean almost no disencentives for polluters.

No, I meant what I said.

I'm glad you agree the carbon price put in with an initial fixed-price period is progressing to a market based price.

Your concern that the European market will not provide the appropriate disincentives is interesting. Do you think an actual tax, rather than a free market solution, would provide better incentives ?

The reality is the GFC has done far more for the environment than any govt policy.

Likely, but that's a temporary hiccup not a structural change.

 

[drsmithy]

"I don't rule out the possibility of legislating a Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme, a market-based mechanism," she said of the next parliament. "I rule out a carbon tax."
This is the strongest message Ms Gillard has sent about action on carbon pricing.
While any carbon price would not be triggered until after the 2013 election, Ms Gillard would have two potential legislative partners next term - the Coalition or the Greens. She would legislate the carbon price next term if sufficient consensus existed.

So the Greens basically twisted her arm then

I'm glad you agree Labor had a policy of carbon pricing going into the 2010 election.

However, it is somewhat at odds with the claim that the 10% of people voting Greens are imposing their views on the other 90%, when a sizeable chunk of that 90% supported a party with a broadly similar policy on carbon pricing.

 

[Pukka]

I'm glad you agree Labor had a policy of carbon pricing going into the 2010 election.

However, it is somewhat at odds with the claim that the 10% of people voting Greens are imposing their views on the other 90%, when a sizeable chunk of that 90% supported a party with a broadly similar policy on carbon pricing.

The only bit I read was

I rule out a carbon tax & any carbon price would not be triggered until after the 2013 election

That was until the greens added a bit more influence than their 10% deserved

 

[Pukka]

It’s obvious that many politicians just don’t want to listen. However, you can help us make them listen and take notice by reminding them that there are 5 million recreational fishers in Australia and WE FISH and WE VOTE.
We have less than 26 days to make a difference, but we need to SPEAK UP!

Share this message far and wide. Forward this message to all your family, friends, fishing mates, work colleagues, next-door neighbour and anyone else you think might be interested.

Write to Kevin Rudd and tell him: DON'T LOCK US OUT - HERE

Another minority group of 5M

 

[drsmithy]

The only bit I read was

I rule out a carbon tax & any carbon price would not be triggered until after the 2013 election

I can't help you with wilful ignorance. That's a personal choice.

That was until the greens added a bit more influence than their 10% deserved

How, exactly, do you determine how much "influence" 10% of the population "deserve" ?

 

[Pukka]

How, exactly, do you determine how much "influence" 10% of the population "deserve" ?

Less than the other 90%

 

[drsmithy]

Less than the other 90%

Which they have (pretty much by definition, in fact).

Indeed, in the House of Reps that 10% of the electorate has nearly no representation at all, so their influence is, in fact, practically nonexistent.

I await an issue whereby the 10% of the electorate represented by the Greens have "imposed" policy on the other 90%. This would require the other 90% of the electorate to be in significant disagreement on said issue.

It could, perhaps, accompany a summary of those "ultra left wing anti business" Greens policies.

 

[JohnK]

Just "unsubscribe" and then it's over

Not subscribed.

Very difficult to avoid though as it is at the top of New posts list most of the time.

 

[erkpod]

Not subscribed.

Very difficult to avoid though as it is at the top of New posts list most of the time.

I manage to avoid many many threads that don't interest me.

 

[drsmithy]

Not subscribed.

Very difficult to avoid though as it is at the top of New posts list most of the time.

I know what you mean.

I have trouble not buying the first thing listed on the menu when I go to restaurants as well.

 

[whatmeworry]

Anybody voting from overseas?
Australians overseas face being locked out of elections

 

[Mak404matt]

Anybody voting from overseas?
Australians overseas face being locked out of elections

A last minute trip now means I'll be voting at the airport on the way out. They are setting up polling booths at PER yes?

 

[medhead]

Well, Google is their friend

Yeah google is a friend when you know what you're looking to find. For the rest of us without mental telepathy, it ain't that friend.

 

[Skyring]

I await an issue whereby the 10% of the electorate represented by the Greens have "imposed" policy on the other 90%. This would require the other 90% of the electorate to be in significant disagreement on said issue.

Ours isn't a direct democracy, where the people vote directly on every matter before Parliament. We have a representative democracy, where we select people to represent us. The party system further interferes with any notion of smooth transition from public opinion to public policy. So the Greens and Independents had a disproportionally large impact over the past three years.