Qantas A220 to do trips to Asia opening new opportunities (rumor)

[oz_mark]

True, but they’re only expecting to have around 6 or 7 A220s by the time the last 717 is retired, hence E190s picking up the slack.

That may be so, but that is very different to saying they haven't ordered enough to replace the 717s. They have.

 

[SYD]

That may be so, but that is very different to saying they haven't ordered enough to replace the 717s. They have.

and then some.

 

[jase05]

Re: Pushka's reply, QF's frenemy, ie, AirNZ and QR already do the job, not sure if QF is ever interested in bringing int flights into or out of ADL again.

QR finishes up ADL-AKL soon and NZ has the garbage Y only aircraft from ADL-AKL which I refuse to fly in so we are forced to go to the East coast to get to NZ

 

[RichardMEL]

Coo, narrow body on a plane from Aust to SIN, now that is real cheapo now.
Real cheapskate.
Aust - NZ on a narrow body plane, maybe in J, but to SIN cooped up in a narrow body down the back in discY, coo, that will be a pain ful experience.

Rubbish. You're totally ignoring the hash realities.

1. ADL clearly doesn't have the demand (at least for QF to make it work) to support the larger aircraft you prefer.

Yes, I know you will point to SQ throwing 350's and whatever into ADL - but that's because that's flying into their hub and the economies are different.

2. You may have your head in the sand but narrowbodies have been commonly used trans atlantic flights of 6-8ish hours (akin to ADL-SIN) for years and years. Heck, I saw a thing just yesterday about IcelandAir flying KEF-YVR in a 757.

3. The experience in Y on an A321XLR might actually be a bit better than you think due to the slightly wider cabin width. Sure, it depends how QF configure these things, but there is scope for a Y experience - at least seating and cabin - akin to a SQ A350 (obviously the soft product would probably be much worse).

I think there is an inherent bias for widebodies. I do absolutely understand this - specially in J - but SQ's 737 MAX J, B6 Mint in the 321, even lie flat seats on the likes of UA mean that J can still work in a narrow body.

I recently saw one of the well known youtube bloggers (Nonstop Dan) do a trip on a SK A321XLR from GOT to... gee I want to say NYC but it may have been somewhere else. A very secondary market which SK just couldn't make happen from a place like GOT, but the 321 worked. He was in J, but really made the point that it worked better and the product was NOT that much worse (comparing SK products) than in the mainline, and he avoided a connecting flight in somewhere like ARN or CPH.

This would be similar for ADL pax who might want to go to SIN (for perhaps further into Asia from there) - save a few hours by bypassing MEL/SYD/PER and go direct almost certainly preferable. This is exactly what this aircraft was designed to do. Much like the 787 was to open up the longer routes without the demand profile for a 747/380 (and look at how well that has worked), this is where the 321XLR fits - you can't fill an A330-200/300, but could make it work with the 321.

You might call it cheap - but I do not. Definitely economics at play but should QF actually FLY ADL-SIN (and that's debateable because.. well... QF) it makes a LOT of sense economically to fly and open up the route for folks in ADL.

Esp row DEF.

What does this even mean?

 

[Quickstatus]

Esp row DEF.
===

The A220 has possibly the widest Y seats of any Y class.
AC quotes 19in and DL 18.6 in

And don't forget there is only one column of middle seats unlike the 737

 

[TheInsider]

I did see something of note on the QF Investor Day presentation, shared earlier in the month. It was tagged against the A321XLR, rather the A220:

View attachment 334182
Here's the link to the full slide deck - this one is on slide 21:

https://investor.qantas.com/DownloadFile.axd?file=/Report/ComNews/20230530/02670818.pdf

Cheers,
Matt.

Just putting it out there. But see how the A220 is Qantas branded and not QantasLink.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

Didn't realize that the 220 had wider than 17in across seats.
Seating on the AC side, ie, the one with only 2 rows, might be ok.
AC would be left hand side of aisle, DEF is right hand side of aisle.
Granted QF might put them as AB, DEF.

 

[TheInsider]

Didn't realize that the 220 had wider than 17in across seats.
Seating on the AC side, ie, the one with only 2 rows, might be ok.
AC would be left hand side of aisle, DEF is right hand side of aisle.
Granted QF might put them as AB, DEF.

Does it really make any difference on how QF make the seat letters?
It's simply 2 seats, aisle then three seats. Who cares about the letter.

 

[Pushka]

QR finishes up ADL-AKL soon and NZ has the garbage Y only aircraft from ADL-AKL which I refuse to fly in so we are forced to go to the East coast to get to NZ

And Emirates not showing any sign of returning yet those flights, along with Qatar, were always packed.

 

[sap1l]

I'm hoping that with the new narrowbodies at some point QF introduces more point-to-point routes to South-East Asia.

Personally, I would love a SYD/MEL-KUL route - better local connections out of KUL (via MH) now that 3K has moved to SIN T4 (and I fly SYD-KUL pretty often ). Poor MH Point/SC earnings means that flying into KUL from anywhere in Australia pretty much has to be done via SIN unless you aren't using QF FF.

 

[BNEFlyer]

There's really no argument against flying a small narrowbody on a long flight or an international flight. The question is more around which routes would be best served by an A220 or A321XLR.

There are flights by SQ, FI, GF, SK, SV, TP, B6, CM, AC, TS and others flying narrowbodies on flights up to 8 hours long.

FI flies KEF-MCO with a Max8, TP flies LIS-IAD with an A321LR, AC flies YUL-SEA/SFO with the A220-300. And right now SK is flying YYZ-CPH on an A321LR with a flight time of 7h36m.

 

[Quickstatus]

AB, DEF.

Some airlines are AB, CDE
Some AC DEF
Another airline AC HJK - can you guess which one?

Might be a good trivial question

 

[jpp42]

There are flights by SQ, FI, GF, SK, SV, TP, B6, CM, AC, TS and others flying narrowbodies on flights up to 8 hours long.

Exactly, and while the B757 wasn't too popular in Asia/Pacifc, but in N.Am and Europe where these are workhorses, this is nothing new. The 757 is quite comparable to the A321LR in many ways (wiki lists range as 3,915 nm, enough for many transatlantic flights - I took one from AMS-PHL which is an example of the type of market narrow bodies are good for). They've also been a staple of European charter airlines. It's too bad that Boeing hasn't come up with a new generation 757's, it was a great plane in many ways. Delta is sticking with them for now - still 111 in service.

 

[AustraliaPoochie]

You need to know the seat row, right off the top of your head, so that you can slide onto the plane, knowing where to plonk yourself.
Yes, most people would not care, but some do.

 

[Quickstatus]

right off the top of your head,

The seat row is on the boarding pass. No need to involve any brain power

 

[RichardMEL]

Well at least Poochie's seemingly random "DEF" is now clearer to me. I had no idea what the heck he was on about.

So poochie, no response regarding use of an aircraft like the A3221XLR for say ADL-SIN? or still going with the "cheapskate" line which makes no real sense either?

btw another example of a long haul narrowbody is VA using the 73G (and then MAX) for CNS-Tokyo.

 

[encryptededdy]

I just hope QF actually puts a respectable J product on the A321XLRs. Preferably lie flats, but at the very least something like the Collins Air Rest on Oman/Cathay. I don't think I would enjoy a Collins MiQ or similar for such a long journey (unless QF sells it at PE prices, but we all know they won't).

 

[mviy]

so we are forced to go to the East coast to get to NZ

And that is a problem? Why fly direct when you can fly indirect? I am on the East Coast and I have never flown direct to NZ even though I could have. QF provides more SC for flying indirect.

 

[RichardMEL]

QF finalised order for 9 more A220-300's today in Paris, bringing total to 29.

Fair scope there for some interesting routes...

Qantas finalises order for 9 more Airbus A220s in Paris

The Flying Kangaroo had announced its intention to take delivery of the extra narrowbodies in February but rubber-stamped the decision with Airbus at the Paris Air Show.

australianaviation.com.au

 

[Himeno]

starting to replace the dash 8s?