Qantas deleted my frequent flyer points without warning!

[JohnK]

Here is a silly thought totally out of left field and too difficult to implement or for most to comprehend.

Points/miles never expire for the life of the FF program.

Silly hey....

 

[GalaxyNexus]

Does the terms and conditions of the QFF program mentions something like "we're going to send you an email before expiry"?

Even then, emails can be lost along the way, with the usual culprit being the spam filter on the receiver side, so really not receiving an email does not necessarily mean they don't send them.

 

[Aussie_flyer]

I think they need to restore the points as I have not received an email. like other posters said, other airlines clearly state the expiry date on the account page, not the date of last activity like Qantas, then one has to go and calculate and date back and so on, wouldn't it just be easier and much more user-friendly to post the actual expiry date!!!??? It is not a big deal and I am not an idiot, but their system doesn't make sense to me. Furthermore, I don't live in Australia, I reside in the US so I can't just go to Woolworth and buy groceries. The last time I needed an eligible activity to earn points, I made a purchase from their online travel store. In my opinion it is clear that Qantas is keeping account expiry dates hidden, and then ooops, you didn't pay attention and you lose your points. I am so fed up, wrote so many emails but I will keep writing until I get my points back.

Oh you simply should sue them in court.

Good luck!

 

[mannej]

Does the terms and conditions of the QFF program mentions something like "we're going to send you an email before expiry"?

Even then, emails can be lost along the way, with the usual culprit being the spam filter on the receiver side, so really not receiving an email does not necessarily mean they don't send them.

Yes it does very clearly - email if you've elected to get e-statements, snail mail otherwise

 

[ozbeachbabe]

I think for something as serious as removing all of a persons points then Qantas need to go back to snail mail. Emails can be too unreliable. If a member is about to loos 400K points then write to them, tell them what happens if they don't earn any points, make it crystal clear.

They would still probably whinge even then saying QF should have followed up the letter with a phone call.

How many people actually read their emails anyway? Same goes for snail mail correspondence.

Another example was when the baggage allowance changed a couple of years ago. There was a mail out telling people about the changes yet when people got slugged with excess baggage charges they would always say "no-one told me this was going to happen."

I've only met one person who said "oh yeah, I remember reading something about that".

I don't see it any different from a warranty for a fridge in that Westinghouse won't send you a letter just prior to your warranty running out advising you of its imminent expiration - you have to diarise it.

One way to minimise expiring points is tracking them in an application such as Award Wallet where many of your airline & hotel frequent traveller programs are housed in the one place so a quick glance will show you when your points are due to expire.

 

[oz_mark]

The online activity statement also has some sort of warning it's about to happen as well.

 

[nlagalle]

You may keep emailing them but I honestly don't think you will get anywhere...

 

[lovetravellingoz]

I have several thousand Singapore Airlines miles expiring in the next 30 days, and no email/letter from them!

Odd.

I get regular updates from them.

Also on their website when you are getting near to expiry (as in many months prior ) it is highlighted on your page that points will be expiring.

SQ also allow you for a small fee to extend the points for another 6 months.

I had about 160K due expire from June spread over about 4 months, and it had been highlighted since about Xmas.

I have just this month redeemed them.

On their site you can also look at what points are expiring in the next 12 months.

 

[dfcatch]

I think the best suggestion is the introduction of a reinstatement fee.

1/ Those who don't care won't worry - and QF pockets the breakage.

2/ Those who do care generate ancillary revenue for QF and are more likely to generate new activity to ensure they don't let their points expire a second time (generating ongoing points revenue).

3/ It's a very fair system.

 

[JohnPhelan]

I am so fed up, wrote so many emails but I will keep writing until I get my points back.

Won't happen - nor should it.

 

[Pollywaffle]

Well, I hope you can come back and tell us your points were reinstated.

I think they need to restore the points as I have not received an email. like other posters said, other airlines clearly state the expiry date on the account page, not the date of last activity like Qantas, then one has to go and calculate and date back and so on, wouldn't it just be easier and much more user-friendly to post the actual expiry date!!!??? It is not a big deal and I am not an idiot, but their system doesn't make sense to me. Furthermore, I don't live in Australia, I reside in the US so I can't just go to Woolworth and buy groceries. The last time I needed an eligible activity to earn points, I made a purchase from their online travel store. In my opinion it is clear that Qantas is keeping account expiry dates hidden, and then ooops, you didn't pay attention and you lose your points. I am so fed up, wrote so many emails but I will keep writing until I get my points back.

The last activity date is the date from when you 18 months non-activity start ticking. You don't need to backtrack.

 

[mella2007]

You still haven't mentioned how many points? (Or not that I could see)

 

[GoldCanyon340]

I'm not completely adverse to a fee for FF points reinstatement (apart from my personal conviction that you shouldn't reward ignorance), but I think QF is in danger of being damned if you do, damned if you don't here. If QF charges too little then the admin cost may not outweigh a staff member's investigation time; too much and the media, and possibly a few people on the Interweb, will go into apoplexy. Yes, I know other carriers allow this but I'm not sure the best policy is always appearing to catch up to competitors to benefit a small minority. Apart from Skybed Mk I of course.

 

[Downwind]

<redacted attacking comments>

I don't see it any different from a warranty for a fridge in that Westinghouse won't send you a letter just prior to your warranty running out advising you of its imminent expiration - you have to diarise it.

The significant difference with warranties is that they aren't worth the paper they're printed on. Consumer Law generally overrides ANY warranty that a company may give for its products. No such protection exists with QF FF points. Secondly, a warranty is a complementary good that only applies to the item that it specifically complements. FF points do not. They are a future benefit intended to be used for something entirely removed from the actual "product" from which they resulted. So whilst you may not see it any differently, it very much is.

 

[drewbles]

Why all this nastiness and vitriol? Am I the only one that finds a lot of the replies on here rude and unhelpful?

I think you'll find you're asking the wrong crowd. The people on here are generally far more knowledgeable about the intricacies of the Qantas Frequent Flyer program. As a result, you'll be hard pressed to find a regular around here that is not aware of the 18 month 'no earn, lose your points' clause.

The other issue is that it's *so* easy to earn points to keep your account active. A simple Woolworths Everyday Reward shop for $31 once every 18 months, and they're kept active. Rent a car with a partner, earn some points, they stay active. Stay at a hotel, pay an Optus bill, go to a Restaurant that Qantas partner with (and take your FF card), Buy some tyres at a partner, fly with any Oneworld airline, pay for the JQ points earn option, and the list just goes on and on.

So, whilst we may sympathise with your loss in general, you'll be pressed to find anyone here who will not agree that Qantas have only done what their terms say, and as such, won't reverse the decision.

I wish you the best of luck trying to get them back, but I don't believe you're going to be successful (and lawyers/ACCC/Today Tonight will have no effect; it's very well known and Qantas don't hide it away. It's in the T's and C's yes, but so are lots of other obscure things. The 18 month expiry is no secret.

 

[Downwind]

The people on here are generally far more knowledgeable about the intricacies of the Qantas Frequent Flyer program.

So, whilst we may sympathise with your loss in general, you'll be pressed to find anyone here who will not agree that Qantas have only done what their terms say, and as such, won't reverse the decision.

I wish you the best of luck trying to get them back, but I don't believe you're going to be successful (and lawyers/ACCC/Today Tonight will have no effect; it's very well known and Qantas don't hide it away. It's in the T's and C's yes, but so are lots of other obscure things. The 18 month expiry is no secret.

Without going OT, given the members extensive knowledge, I question why there isn't more of an adverse reaction to QF's failure to abide by its own T&C's.

Back on topic, I'm not the OP and haven't lost any points so your sympathy is appreciated but misdirected. All I'm saying is that despite the T&C's I disagree with the deletion of 400,000 points from someone's account with nothing more than an email. Furthermore, I fail to see the difficulty or cost to QF of reinstating them.
If QF are so hell bent on enforcing the T&C's, perhaps they might want to have a look in their own backyard and start ensuring priority boarding and priority luggage are provided to every eligible member instead of ripping off some poor chap to the tune of 400,000 points. You can't hold customers to terms and conditions that you yourself selectively disregard.

 

[ashleyn]

Without going OT, given the members extensive knowledge, I question why there isn't more of an adverse reaction to QF's failure to abide by its own T&C's.

Back on topic, I'm not the OP and haven't lost any points so your sympathy is appreciated but misdirected. All I'm saying is that despite the T&C's I disagree with the deletion of 400,000 points from someone's account with nothing more than an email. Furthermore, I fail to see the difficulty or cost to QF of reinstating them.
If QF are so hell bent on enforcing the T&C's, perhaps they might want to have a look in their own backyard and start ensuring priority boarding and priority luggage are provided to every eligible member instead of ripping off some poor chap to the tune of 400,000 points. You can't hold customers to terms and conditions that you yourself selectively disregard.

Not long ago you were accusing members of nastiness and vitriol but reading your last post I that's all I see. You have gone OT to rant about PB and PL as well. Time for a chill pill I think.

 

[medhead]

<redacted>

What makes you or anyone else an authority on whether it is easy or not for any given member to earn points?

What? Besides the fact that many here are extremely well practised at earning points? That many know about 43 different ways to earn points and look for new earning opportunities everyday. Exactly how hard is it to spend $31 at woolworths once every 18 months?

 

[GoldCanyon340]

The significant difference with warranties is that they aren't worth the paper they're printed on. Consumer Law generally overrides ANY warranty that a company may give for its products. No such protection exists with QF FF points. Secondly, a warranty is a complementary good that only applies to the item that it specifically complements. FF points do not. They are a future benefit intended to be used for something entirely removed from the actual "product" from which they resulted. So whilst you may not see it any differently, it very much is.

Um, this statement is so incredibly wrong that, well, where do I go?

 

[Keelan]

Um, this statement is so incredibly wrong that, well, where do I go?

i think it has some merit - I think he means that if you get a warranty with a fridge - you don't expect that warranty to give you another fridge at the end of the warranty (as in, outside the warranty period, it is not a token for a new fridge) whereas with points, they can be viewed as a new flight in the future, a totally seperate flight than those on which the points were earned. Regardless, I think the thread is getting unnecessarily aggressive in tone from all sides - #chillpillsallround