Qantas / Emirates tie up (Partnership inc. Codeshare, Status)

[The Rok]

QF WILL be flying to DBX and you will be able to terminate there, not not until they have permission to...

 

[ozmille]

QF WILL be flying to DBX and you will be able to terminate there, not not until they have permission to...

Hopefully that will come soon, in the meantime I have a 3 day stopover booked for next August on my way to LHR, hotels are heaps cheaper in DXB than in SIN

 

[Flashback]

The way I read it is the flights will happen regardless of approval, however FF benefits etc. will not happen UNLESS the approval comes e.g. essentially if no approval, then they're just doing a partner non-alliance codeshare type agreement

 

[ajw373]

The way I read it is the flights will happen regardless of approval, however FF benefits etc. will not happen UNLESS the approval comes e.g. essentially if no approval, then they're just doing a partner non-alliance codeshare type agreement

There are two parts to this. One is Qantas needs the rights to be able to carry passengers to/from the UAE. At present they don't so whilst they can route their a/c through Dubai they can only carry passengers carry on to and coming from London. Once they get the traffic rights they can see Dubai as a destination.

The 2nd part of the JSA which covers code shares to Dubai and beyond as well as the FF type benefits etc.

If the JSA fails, and it seems it won't there is really no point for Qantas to be flying to Dubai. So either they are very confident or are making a point.

 

[dot]

The lack of ability to fly QF to DXB seems to be a big hole in this arrangement. If you want to fly to DXB, you have to book an EK ticket and therefore earn no SCs or points, or stopover on an LHR ticket which isn't practical.

While it might kill QFi, I personally think this should not be approved by the ACCC, as QF and EK are clearly competitors and it is not a level playing field.

Huh? QF have announced and set preliminary timetables to fly to DXB (QF metal) They also announced that QFF members will earn miles on EK flights as well as SCs on QF codeshares (earning SCs on EK fight numbers is still TBA)

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[ComeFlyWithMe]

Huh? QF have announced and set preliminary timetables to fly to DXB (QF metal) They also announced that QFF members will earn miles on EK flights as well as SCs on QF codeshares (earning SCs on EK fight numbers is still TBA)

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Advised today by both the person doing the re-accomodation of my APR13 SIN-SYD F flight which was downgraded to business, and the QF Premium Desk that flights to/from DXB are not and will not be bookable on QF *ever* as they do not have, nor are they applying for landing rights other than those of the QF1/2 & 9/10 through traffic to LHR, or onward connections with EK to other destinations.

The staff could be mis-informed, but I take their comments at face value in the absence of any other official information.

And I have absolutely no confidence in the ability to earn SCs when ticketed on EK plate as they are not in OW.

 

[Flashback]

And I have absolutely no confidence in the ability to earn SCs when ticketed on EK plate as they are not in OW.

It's already been mentioned that if on an EK code no SC will be earned.

 

[dot]

Advised today by both the person doing the re-accomodation of my APR13 SIN-SYD F flight which was downgraded to business, and the QF Premium Desk that flights to/from DXB are not and will not be bookable on QF *ever* as they do not have, nor are they applying for landing rights other than those of the QF1/2 & 9/10 through traffic to LHR, or onward connections with EK to other destinations.

The staff could be mis-informed, but I take their comments at face value in the absence of any other official information.

"... *OTHER* than QF 1/2, 9/10..." They are applying for landing rights for these flights, otherwise they couldn't land... you can't book them yet because they're not yet approved - just as you can't book any of the QF codeshares on EK yet. You will be able to fly on QF 1/9 to DXB and get off the plane once QF have approvals in place for those flights.

And I have absolutely no confidence in the ability to earn SCs when ticketed on EK plate as they are not in OW.

Being part of OW is not the key factor wrt SCs - its up to the negotiations between OF & EK. QF already has a non-OW partner that credit SCs - If EK want reciprocal status earning credits for their members on QF flight numbers, I would expect QF would ask for the same for its members on EK flights.



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[dot]

It's already been mentioned that if on an EK code no SC will be earned.

Who said so? The last statement I saw from QF on the subject was that it was TBA...

 

[ozmille]

"... *OTHER* than QF 1/2, 9/10..." They are applying for landing rights for these flights, otherwise they couldn't land... you can't book them yet because they're not yet approved

At the moment I am booked on QF1 to DXB three day stopover and then QF1 to LHR, we'll see how that pans out

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

"... *OTHER* than QF 1/2, 9/10..." They are applying for landing rights for these flights, otherwise they couldn't land... you can't book them yet because they're not yet approved - just as you can't book any of the QF codeshares on EK yet. You will be able to fly on QF 1/9 to DXB and get off the plane once QF have approvals in place for those flights.

I think you will find there are different landing rights as a destination rather than for a stopover point, and in addition it's possibly more a sales restriction which will form part of the JSA most likely at the insistence of EK to protect their own rights.

Being part of OW is not the key factor wrt SCs - its up to the negotiations between OF & EK. QF already has a non-OW partner that credit SCs - If EK want reciprocal status earning credits for their members on QF flight numbers, I would expect QF would ask for the same for its members on EK flights.

I think you are dreaming. There is a difference between airlines in which they have an ownership stake in part or full (FJ, JQ, QLink), and a foreign codeshare partner.

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

Who said so? The last statement I saw from QF on the subject was that it was TBA...

I wouldn't hold your breath, I won't be.

 

[geordieladinoz]

I think you are dreaming. There is a difference between airlines in which they have an ownership stake in part or full (FJ, JQ, QLink), and a foreign codeshare partner.

What about South African Airlines and others?

See here: Frequent Flyer - Earning Points - Fly - Airline Partners. Look at the bottom of the page after the OW partners. Flying on these carriers will get SC's, surely? Just add Emirates to this list.

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

What about South African Airlines, DragonAir and others?

See here: Frequent Flyer - Earning Points - Fly - Airline Partners. Look at the bottom of the page after the OW partners. Flying on these carriers will get SC's, I know I have from DragonAir. Just add Emirates to this list.

DragonAir is a subsidiary of CX - a OW carrier, hence the SCs. Don't confuse points with SCs.
I don't believe you earn SCs on an SA flight number.

Extract:

* You can earn Status credits when flying on eligible Qantas, oneworld Alliance airlines (American Airlines®, airberlin, British Airways, Cathay Pacific Airways, Finnair, Iberia, JAL (Japan Airlines), LAN, Royal Jordanian Airlines and S7), Air Pacific, Jetstar or QantasLink services - see the Airline Earning Table
. Status credits can be earned on flights operated by Jetstar Airways where a Qantas flight number is entered on your ticket when booked in Y, B, H, K or W class, or on a Jetstar Starter Plus, Starter Max or Business Max fare only.
On eligible flights with that airlines flight number on your ticket.​

 

[anat0l]

What about South African Airlines and others?

You can't earn QF SCs if you are flying on a ticket marketed by a non-oneworld or non-Qantas carrier. So if you buy a ticket with a SA flight number on it, if you claim it against QFF you will only earn points.

On the other hand, if you book a ticket with a QF flight number but SA operates it, you get SCs and points (according to the QF earn table).

The same goes for MU, 9W and other airlines.

The only exceptions to the "non-oneworld or non-Qantas carrier" clause are Jetstar and Air Pacific.

Dragonair and Qantaslink are oneworld registered subsidiary / affiliates so they are treated just like oneworld airlines. (Jetstar is a Qantas subsidiary but not a oneworld registered affiliate; there is only one key exception to JQ and oneworld, which is LONEx fares).


It would be really nice if EK was part of the "exceptions" list, but history suggests it isn't looking that way. That said, all it means is that you will always need to book on the QF code. The key disadvantage of this is if the QF and EK prices do not see eye to eye.

 

[nlagalle]

The lack of ability to fly QF to DXB seems to be a big hole in this arrangement. If you want to fly to DXB, you have to book an EK ticket and therefore earn no SCs or points, or stopover on an LHR ticket which isn't practical.

While it might kill QFi, I personally think this should not be approved by the ACCC, as QF and EK are clearly competitors and it is not a level playing field.

Not true.. you will be able to book them as codeshares on EK metal via the qantas website.. so FF and SC earn.

 

[ajw373]

At the moment I am booked on QF1 to DXB three day stopover and then QF1 to LHR, we'll see how that pans out

That's clearly ok. The important thing is though you couldn't at present fly QF1 to Dubai and then return, you need to continue on to LHR.

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

Not true.. you will be able to book them as codeshares on EK metal via the qantas website.. so FF and SC earn.

If history is anything to go by, this will be at the QF inflated 'premium' price.

I personally would prefer QF metal to DXB, especially in F, but we'll see how their relevant approvals go.

 

[The Rok]

If history is anything to go by, this will be at the QF inflated 'premium' price.

I personally would prefer QF metal to DXB, especially in F, but we'll see how their relevant approvals go.

You would take QF F over EK F? On an A380?

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

You would take QF F over EK F? On an A380?

Yes QF A380, for a few reasons, firstly the food is better on QF IMO, and in addition your suite is understated and elegant, as opposed to tacky and blingy.

The shower on EK is a minor benefit, but when you consider the 3 seconds you get to use it, not a major drawcard. Plus I prefer to shower on the ground where the water is hot, free flowing and untimed.

If I had wanted to fly EK, I could have purchased my ticket from them. I however actually like to fly QF, enjoy my personally funded WP status, and prefer to be on their metal as much as possible. Of course, I'm the reason they fly, but they seem to forget that when swapping out QF metal for codeshares with an airline I have no interest in flying, and through a hub I don't have much interest in flying through either. Apparently I'm not the reason they fly anymore.

In addition to this, the recent handling of my re-accomodation of SIN-SYD flights in F was frankly appalling. "Mr ComeFlyWithMe, we've downgraded you to business and provided you with a refund. There are no other options available to you. Enjoy your flight."