Qantas FF and Woolworths create new loyalty alliance

[codash1099]

I can't see this as being a big points earner for most people, but then is going to depend a bit on earn rate. Even at a point per dollar, for most people it is not going to earn any where near what a credit card offers in terms of points gained per month.

It will be a good supplement to other ways of earning though.

The way I read it, double dipping will be the go. The Everyday Rewards card is, IIRC, not a credit card but just a means of storing the fuel discount earned. If it's as much as a point per dollar, that will be equivalent to double points for most Credit cards.

 

[codash1099]

Most likely 1 QFF point for every $5 spend or something...I don't see QF freely throwing points around the place for a higher earning rate...

I think it will depend more on what WW will be prepared to pay for, rather than QF. I imagine QF would be happy to provide as many points as WW can afford.

 

[oz_mark]

The way I read it, double dipping will be the go. The Everyday Rewards card is, IIRC, not a credit card but just a means of storing the fuel discount earned. If it's as much as a point per dollar, that will be equivalent to double points for most Credit cards.

Woolworths also have their HSBC issued card, and I am sure they would prefer that you double dip with that. Perhaps going forward, with that, you will need to choose between Woolworths vouchers or QFF points. The rewards program associated with the credit card is hardly startling in its generosity though.

 

[turtlemichael]

Great more points being thrown around. All we need. More people competing for classic awards. One positive for me - strengthen my resolve to stay away from QFF as the more widespread the points earning opportunities becomes the more difficult it will be to get reasonably priced awards.

Yes, points are being continually devalued. I guess I really mean that I will have more competition from others for award bookings .

On the brighter side if all else fails we may be able to use our QFF points at Woolworths :mrgreen:

 

[turtlemichael]

On a more serious note, I don't think any of us should be happy about this. It marks the most sigficant movement of the scheme to a Frequent Buyers' Scheme so far. At whatever the earning level for "Woolies points" turns out to be, it will create many more earners, maybe even millions more. The value of points will be even further diminished.

While it may be good for QF's bottom line and the price for which the QFF scheme is on the market, it will reduce the opportunities for flight redemption for most or all who are actually loyal QF flyers. The only opportunities for redemption will be those exclusively based on status.

If that sounds selfish, I guess it is.

 

[vet]

What are the odds of getting a ff seat on Qantas on school holidays after every family gets a Woolies card and pays for liqour, cigs and groceries on plastic?

 

[straitman]

What are the odds of getting a ff seat on Qantas on school holidays after every family gets a Woolies card and pays for liqour, cigs and groceries on plastic?

About the same as the family IMHO.

 

[DJ737]

Hi there

How many cans of Whiskas and slabs of VB for a Y trip to LHR?

Air Asia here i come, plus STN is a better London arrival for me.

Cheers
DJ737

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Great more points being thrown around. All we need. More people competing for classic awards. One positive for me - strengthen my resolve to stay away from QFF as the more widespread the points earning opportunities becomes the more difficult it will be to get reasonably priced awards.

The average punter may say put through $10-30K per annum.

Even at a point per $ (Most likely it will not be that generous) that is say only 10-30 k per annum.

So without decent earn from other means the average shopper will not suddenly be redeeming lots of flights...

 

[JohnK]

Very interesting news but from the sounds of it we will need a Woolworths credit card enrolled in Everyday Rewards and direct sweep points to QFF. Until more details are revealed I would prefer to continue earning points in Amex MR and keep them there until I decide what to do with the points.

 

[turtlemichael]

The average punter may say put through $10-30K per annum.

Even at a point per $ (Most likely it will not be that generous) that is say only 10-30 k per annum.

So without decent earn from other means the average shopper will not suddenly be redeeming lots of flights...

Add in families combining points, add in a large increase in QFF members, add in credit card points going exclusively to QF and then try and get a classic award to LA. Good luck :-|

 

[oz_mark]

Very interesting news but from the sounds of it we will need a Woolworths credit card enrolled in Everyday Rewards and direct sweep points to QFF. Until more details are revealed I would prefer to continue earning points in Amex MR and keep them there until I decide what to do with the points.

You will need to have an everdyay rewards card, but you will not have to have a Woolworths credit card (although they will likely provide some incentive for that). Double Dipping will require a direct sweep card, but points from spending shouldn't. You should be able to still pay on Amex an get the MR point, and also get some number of FF points through the Everyday Rewards program.

Until there are more details, you don't really have much choice but to continue with existing arrangements.

Overall, I am surprised they made an announcement so early in the piece, although I guess they must have made some headway with what the overall offer will be.

 

[medhead]

Add in families combining points, add in a large increase in QFF members, add in credit card points going exclusively to QF and then try and get a classic award to LA. Good luck :-|

Sorry, I think this is being totally over stated. It's just not possible to earn that many points that it'll be a problem. My family spends about $13000 on groceries, about $1500 on fuel and who knows on grog at woolies, since I home brew, have a wine club and wineries nearby - maybe $2000.

So a absolute maximum of 16500 points per year. That's going to get my family 1 ADL-MEL. Well, spend on the right card an maybe 2 of us get to MEL. That's barely worth the effort.

 

[dot]

Add in families combining points, add in a large increase in QFF members, add in credit card points going exclusively to QF and then try and get a classic award to LA. Good luck :-|

Sorry, I think this is being totally over stated. It's just not possible to earn that many points that it'll be a problem. My family spends about $13000 on groceries, about $1500 on fuel and who knows on grog at woolies, since I home brew, have a wine club and wineries nearby - maybe $2000.

So a absolute maximum of 16500 points per year. That's going to get my family 1 ADL-MEL. Well, spend on the right card an maybe 2 of us get to MEL. That's barely worth the effort.

Additionally, I cant see a lot of non-members forking out the membership fee for QFF just so that they can earn QF miles, when other schemes such as flybuys (Don't laugh - they are competing for the same custom) don't have a joining fee.

 

[oz_mark]

Additionally, I cant see a lot of non-members forking out the membership fee for QFF just so that they can earn QF miles, when other schemes such as flybuys (Don't laugh - they are competing for the same custom) don't have a joining fee.

Unless they give membership away to Everyday Rewards memebers :shock:

 

[simongr]

One thing to consider is that this is marginal points for a lot of people - so this will just top up for some of them...

 

[oz_mark]

One thing to consider is that this is marginal points for a lot of people - so this will just top up for some of them...

There will only be a small number coming in for me regardless of theearning rate, but together with all the other non-flying sources it will start to add up.

 

[turtlemichael]

Sorry, I think this is being totally over stated. It's just not possible to earn that many points that it'll be a problem. My family spends about $13000 on groceries, about $1500 on fuel and who knows on grog at woolies, since I home brew, have a wine club and wineries nearby - maybe $2000.

So a absolute maximum of 16500 points per year. That's going to get my family 1 ADL-MEL. Well, spend on the right card an maybe 2 of us get to MEL. That's barely worth the effort.

Overstated? Maybe. Maybe not.

First, I think your analysis is very light on for grocery/booze/cigarettes/fuel expenditure for many families. I am half of just a two person family and we spend more than that. Even if I am not typical I'd hazard a guess that there are many families spending more than you.

Second, you make the assumption that they'll take a trip a year. Maybe their "big trip" will be every three years with more points accumulated.

Finally, you assume it is discrete expenditure. I think it is much more likely to be added to points already earned on the family credit cards, maybe a trip or two a year on QF already and a use of some of the other non-flying ways you can already earn QFF points. I'd also suggest that a scheme like the Woolies one will increase "points awareness" so more credit cards, rather than cash, are used. The publicity it gets in it's lead in will be deafening.

My guess is that earning 80-100K non-flying points over three years, many of the from a new Woolies deal, will not be too hard. (IF any of them are devoted Amex forum users here, well the sky is the limit!:mrgreen

Another assumption. Lets say 10% of the population do it. Given the share of the market Woolies has I reckon that would be the minimum they would be aiming for. And assume they do a trip each third year.

That means that each year one third of that number, or roughly 700,000, will be coming into the pool seeking the same flights that other QFF'ers want.

I'm obviously making assumptions but even if I'm 50% wrong I stand by my earlier assertion that this is the most significant movement of the QFF scheme to a QFB scheme to date and is not good for those who are actually loyal to QF and earn most of their points by flying.

But I guess most of us knew that anyway. It certainly will increase my desire to get QF point usage bedded in and also to look at alternative non-QF flying uses of which there are quite a few. Those Amex points can have a lot of homes!

 

[oz_mark]

It is a view shared by others. e.g. Business Spectator - Flying backwards

Forgive me for not being exhilarated about Woolworths’ planned entry to Qantas’ Frequent Flyer program.

But I suspect I’m not the only loyal Qantas customer to feel marginalised by today’s development.
The net effect of this deal when it proceeds mid-2009 will be to accelerate the points earning capacity of those who fly rarely - or who don’t fly at all. To the point that a year or two down the track several million more Australians will be competing with genuine frequent flyers for already scarce seats on Qantas flights.

 

[Standby]

It is a view shared by others. e.g. Business Spectator - Flying backwards

QF FF has 5.4M members (thats a sizable chunk of the adult population,especially when considering Mr or Mrs is a member not both generally)..so its reasonable that the FF scheme may grow another Mil or so but as with the current scheme apart from high end earners here
the points earned will take several years to be worthwhile .From the QF perspective its about getting a larger pool generating points and in turn burning them...the split on flights/the QF store will probobly end up being 50-50 or 60-40 as the options to burn are expanded,so I dont think its the death of "Classic availability" as we know it. And points to upgrade are still onloaded by tier status so that still keeps most here ahead of the pack for that Why to PY/J upgrade. JQ INT expansion over the next few years will also help offer more destinations which takes spreads the demand across a wider network.
To float the FF scheme it has to demonstrate it can generate turnover ,
and that means burn..I suspect whilst this is the first big announced tie up there will be many more to follow in the leadup to the float