Qantas thanks its most loyal customers

[nlagalle]

This is true, there's no way she would have known.
I'm not blaming the lounge dragon...or anyone I don't think. I was just all expecting one because of the memo that said WP and CL would get them. I also thought there was some kind of collecting requests and ranking them prior to points upgrades - but it was definately first in best dressed, and I was one to late.

But I believe that memo only referred to MEL,SYD,BNE and maybe ADL. PER wasn't on that list.

 

[markis10]

ODUs have always been FIFU (first in first upgraded) regardless of status in my expereince which is why I get in at T-3 hours.

 

[mannej]

You don't need U inventory for an ODU - you just need the points, and an empty seat.

If you want a confirmed upgrade in advance - then you need U.

Not one to quote the T&C's, but there is reference to availability in Section 17. What applicable booking class is that referring to?

17.5 The provision of On Departure Upgrades is subject to availability in the applicable booking class, airport operational requirements and catering availability. Special meals may not be available in the upgraded class. Qantas may occasionally have to restrict this facility without prior notice on some routes or under special circumstances (for example where there is an unexpected disruption to services resulting in heavy demands on Qantas Club personnel).

Frequent Flyer - About the Program - Terms & Conditions

 

[oz_mark]

But I believe that memo only referred to MEL,SYD,BNE and maybe ADL. PER wasn't on that list.

Yes it was

-For SYD / MEL / BNE / ADL and CBR, this process will only be available Monday to Friday between 0500-0900 and 1500-2000 bases on the customer’s originally booked flight.

-For services from PER to SYD,MEL and BNE the offering will be all day Monday to Friday

 

[maninblack]

Absolutely correct - which is why the AA system of automatic domestic upgrades is not the best option.

But - AA's system of SWUs is a workable option for QFi.

As is NZ's system of comp. upgrades that are still inventory controlled.

Right.

But ultimately the traveling customer doesn't care about all of this or what QF's systems or yield management is. He doesn't care about all the little rules or the fine print. He cares that he is one of 'Qantas most loyal customers', that he pays oodles of $$$ to travel with them every year and keeps getting told how important he is in the promo material and how great a program QFF is.

So he has makes a normal reasonable request and the request does not get granted. After boarding he sees a bucket load of empty seats in Premium and in J.

He says, "this sucks, you don't love me and treat me right".

"Maybe I will take my business to someone else."

"This is not how you should treat your most loyal customers"


PS. Please get rid of the guy with the ponytail!

 

[mannej]

So he has makes a normal reasonable request and the request does not get granted. After boarding he sees a bucket load of empty seats in Premium and in J.

How many airlines offer space available upgrades? Is it the majority.
The flip side that will be argued is that those who pay the big dollars to sit in those classes will start to complain about the product being devalued if you get more upgrades being granted etc. so there is a balance that needs to be found.

 

[harvyk]

The flip side that will be argued is that those who pay the big dollars to sit in those classes will start to complain about the product being devalued if you get more upgrades being granted etc.

The thing is that if you pay the big $$$ to sit in seats other than Y then you have done so knowing that you will be seated in the section which you have paid for regardless of anything else. If nothing else your paying for the certainty which comes with buying PE \ J \ F in the first instance. The people who get upgraded have gone into a lottery, because at the time of booking they have booked into a lower class and are then hoping that they can get an upgrade. Even with dom bookings there is a chance that when you ask to get upgraded it will be denied. Not everyone is as savvy as people here and thus wouldn't think to look on something like EF to see if there is U available.

 

[maninblack]

How many airlines offer space available upgrades? Is it the majority.
The flip side that will be argued is that those who pay the big dollars to sit in those classes will start to complain about the product being devalued if you get more upgrades being granted etc. so there is a balance that needs to be found.

Sure. But I would prefer this than something that really gets me a little peeved, which is paying full fare to travel J to CNS only to see half the cabin filled with JQ flight attendants deadheading (okay - positioning) and even getting their meals before paying customers behind them. (QF FA's have stopped this practice with the meals I have noticed and serve the passengers first)

 

[nlagalle]

Yes it was

Should have read further down the message! :shock:

 

[dfcatch]

Not one to quote the T&C's, but there is reference to availability in Section 17. What applicable booking class is that referring to?

Frequent Flyer - About the Program - Terms & Conditions

I was referring to my previous experiences and what I've been told by QP staff on many occasions.

Like maninblack says - being denied an ODU then boarding to see empty seats (unless they were "fail to boards") is not a good way to reward loyalty.

And let's not get confused with all this talk about "space available upgrades".

Some people seem to be talking about "unlimited complimentary upgrades" which do indeed risk devaluing the premium cabin and premium revenue.

But we are talking about an ODU which is paid for by points.

Points upgrades on domestic are capacity controlled in advance (via U class), and then via ODUs to fill up otherwise empty (and non revenue generating seats).

It's both bad service, and bad business for the OP's situation to occur.

QF would have received the points revenue from the WP had his upgrade been granted. It was not a "free" upgrade.

Points redemptions and upgrades do not devalue the premium cabin - they are an equal form of currency.

Of course - perhaps QF thought they could still sell those seats for cash after flight closing, and perhaps they did. But it still leaves the OP disappointed.

 

[simongr]

It's both bad service, and bad business for the OP's situation to occur.

QF would have received the points revenue from the WP had his upgrade been granted. It was not a "free" upgrade.

Points redemptions and upgrades do not devalue the premium cabin - they are an equal form of currency.

Of course - perhaps QF thought they could still sell those seats for cash after flight closing, and perhaps they did. But it still leaves the OP disappointed.

I have no issue with points based upgrades. I agree that it is annoying to have a points upgrade knocked back and then see empty seats. There was a supplementary issue that the pax was annoyed not to get a free upgrade of two classes when the seat was borked. QF would have earned only loyalty through that upgrade.

 

[maninblack]

I have no issue with points based upgrades. I agree that it is annoying to have a points upgrade knocked back and then see empty seats. There was a supplementary issue that the pax was annoyed not to get a free upgrade of two classes when the seat was borked. QF would have earned only loyalty through that upgrade.

If you are referring to my mate he was not looking for any freebies. He had requested a points upgrade originally and was at all times willing to shell out the points. If the QF 'system" can't deal with that and they would prefer fly empty seats, not get the points and also not even ultimately earn the loyalty then their systems are deficient.

 

[nlagalle]

If you are referring to my mate he was not looking for any freebies. He had requested a points upgrade originally and was at all times willing to shell out the points. If the QF 'system" can't deal with that and they would prefer fly empty seats, not get the points and also not even ultimately earn the loyalty then their systems are deficient.

But as has been mentioned - they can't do points upgrades in the lounges, why even ask them knowing the answer is they can't? I'm not saying the way they have it set up is right, but that is the way it is.. Do other carriers offer ODU on points in the lounge for international travel? CX, VA or SQ?

 

[simongr]

But as has been mentioned - they can't do points upgrades in the lounges, why even ask them knowing the answer is they can't? I'm not saying the way they have it set up is right, but that is the way it is.. Do other carriers offer ODU on points in the lounge for international travel? CX, VA or SQ?

I have actually done it with AA. I was booked in J and aasked the AAngel at the AC (it was the only reason I went to the AC actually) I upped to F LHR-JFK.

 

[maninblack]

But as has been mentioned - they can't do points upgrades in the lounges, why even ask them knowing the answer is they can't? I'm not saying the way they have it set up is right, but that is the way it is.. Do other carriers offer ODU on points in the lounge for international travel? CX, VA or SQ?

You make the assumption that he knows this, I don't know this, I never request international upgrades at the airport because I always travel J, I thought you could, why "can't" you? I think he primarily travels J too so I don't know how often he would have requested upgrades.

If you "can't" buy an upgrade then their system is deficient.

 

[nlagalle]

You make the assumption that he knows this, I don't know this, I never request international upgrades at the airport because I always travel J, I thought you could, why "can't" you? I think he primarily travels J too so I don't know how often he would have requested upgrades.

If you "can't" buy an upgrade then their system is deficient.

I don't know why you can't. The is QF's choice (not saying i agree with it). However from my last 2 trips flying INT, F J and PE we all full, and has generally been the case from my travels. perhaps they don't as they don't have the sort of availability that they do domestically?

I am also sure they aren't the only carrier that operates like this?

 

[mannej]

Once again, my question is how many airlines have a system similar to QF in that you can not purchase (points of paid)ODU?

 

[Oneworldplus2]

I don't know why you can't. The is QF's choice (not saying i agree with it). However from my last 2 trips flying INT, F J and PE we all full, and has generally been the case from my travels. perhaps they don't as they don't have the sort of availability that they do domestically?

I am also sure they aren't the only carrier that operates like this?

When do they stock a plane with food for Int trips, say SYD-SIN? 2 or 3 hours prior? And how much spare do they carry? Upgrading pax sounds simple (new BP on our end), but I think it's fair to say that there is more behind the scene activity going on than we are all led to believe.

 

[wilco]

those who pay the big dollars to sit in those classes will start to complain about the product being devalued if you get more upgrades being granted etc. so there is a balance that needs to be found.

You make it sound like the upgrade is being given away for free. Any points upgrade requires points, which for all intents and purposes is identical to the cash equivalent. So sure, it might cost Qantas a little in the beginning, but keep in mind that they also reduce their points liability so it seems to be a win-win situation.

I think one of the main problems is that FF's are awash with points and are itching to use them and Qantas needs to facilitate this. It would be better for Qantas to get to the point where members want upgrades and flights and dont have the required points rather the situation that exists currently.

I do however, totally agree that some balance needs to be found.

 

[Flashback]

Today, Qantas celebrates 91 years of flying and it is our pleasure to offer our most loyal members bonus Qantas Frequent Flyer points.

From 16 November 2011 until 23 December 2011 Platinum members receive a 100% bonus, Gold members receive a 50% bonus, Silver and selected Bronze members receive a 25% bonus Frequent Flyer points for all Qantas flights (with a QF flight number on your ticket). This is for existing and new bookings and over and above the total points you normally earn.

In addition, if you were directly impacted by industrial action you will be offered a unique Qantas gift or experience, such as complimentary membership to epiQure by Qantas Frequent Flyer – the online food and wine community, a Qantas’ First Lounge or Qantas Club invitation, a voucher for Qantas Valet or Qantas Drive, or a complimentary Q Bag Tag, depending on your tier status.

Emails will be sent shortly to members with full details, terms and conditions.

Any questions just let me know via this thread or via PM.

I wonder how long it is supposed to be taking these to post? I had LHR-SIN and SIN-PER on 6/7 Nov, and I've had some bonus points post (which seem to be for these) 2 days ago (Nov 28). I presume they are for those flights and I'm still waiting for the flights on Nov 23 (PER-SIN and SIN-LHR) to still post?