Qantas to move to new Perth Airport terminal, expand Perth hub

[TY24]

But all that is meaningless. It is the number of Frequent flyers. And just remember WA is only 10% of Australia's population.
80% of australia's population lives in NSW, Victoria and Queensland.

The question is, how many of those frequent flyers hold status?

Just because there’s more FF members in other states, doesn’t necessarily mean there‘s more SG’s and WP’s.

Every man and their dog in Perth is an SG with either QF or VA. The QPub and VA Lounge in Perth are almost impossible to get a seat in depending on the time of day you go.

The resources company I work for employs nearly 30,000 people, I’d estimate that over half of our workforce hold Gold status as a minimum, and that’s a very conservative estimate.

 

[Cognac]

The train stop for Qantas is a kilometre away from the terminal, requiring a shuttle bus, too far to drag your cases, in a tiny suburb called Redcliffe. What idiot designed it like that.

It's not an airport stop and was never meant to be, that's why. Qantas is the idiot that has made it the situation it is today by refusing for so, so long to move to the T1/T2 precinct. The shuttle bus to the train station is a stop-gap to make it less bad because of Qantas.

Perth Airport has a role to play as well, for sure. But when the government was designing the airport rail link it was designed with intent of servicing T1/T2. And they were right to design it that way.

 

[serfty]

Because only a very small minority chooses to fly one-stop with Hawaiian, AirNZ and FJ when travelling between Australia and the USA. The vast majority flies nonstop with QF or competitors also flying nonstop.

And the same will happen to Aus-Europe. It’s bound to happen.

It may take some time but it’s a matter of when, not if.


ME airlines will lose out and the competition QF will need to look out for will be the likes of BA, VS, AF and LH if they seek to start nonstop to Australia as well.

Your comments regarding Australia and USA are irrelevant with respect to PER.

I dispute your assertions. If ME airlines lose out by not having scheduled non stops, they'll go for scheduling them.

 

[moa999]

Qantas is the idiot that has made it the situation it is today by refusing for so, so long to move to the T1/T2 precinct

Takes two to tango.. or in this case argue.
And Qantas is too large to move to T1/T2 until a new terminal (or significant expansion, however you want to number then) is built.

In this case it appears that QF has received one of the main things they wanted.. which is for Perth Airport to spend some money on altering T3 so QF can launch more international flights, rather than having to split operations between the distant terminals.

The airport didnt want to pay for it because the ROI on something you are going to demolish in 5 or so years isn't great.

ME airlines will lose out and the competition QF will need to look out for will be the likes of BA, VS, AF and LH if they seek to start nonstop to Australia as well.

ME will always be able to serve way more destinations than QF can given the geographical advantage.. not everyone wants to go to LHR or whatever other handful of destinations QF might serve direct.

Can't see the airlines you mentioned competing with direct flights to be East Coast in the near term given how specialised the Sunrise aircraft will be (extra tanks and less seats).. but I wouldn't count out Turkish Airlines, or maybe even Greek or Italian airlines being able to fly direct in the future.

Perth is more interesting given a 787 can service it, but few tourists are just doing Perth only, so you likely need to give some revenue to QF or VA for connections.

 

[drron]

The question is, how many of those frequent flyers hold status?

Just because there’s more FF members in other states, doesn’t necessarily mean there‘s more SG’s and WP’s.

Every man and their dog in Perth is an SG with either QF or VA. The QPub and VA Lounge in Perth are almost impossible to get a seat in depending on the time of day you go.

The resources company I work for employs nearly 30,000 people, I’d estimate that over half of our workforce hold Gold status as a minimum, and that’s a very conservative estimate.

So your Government says there are 130000 jobs or job equivalents employed in mining in WA. The figures for Australia are 270000.So just under half in WA. Most in QLD are Fifo and quite a few in NSW. And gold doesn't get you into a Flounge.

And you seem to be ignoring the fact that the East coast has 80% of the population and WA 10%.
So if say 1% of the rest of the population not working in mining held OWE then there would be 8 times the OWEs on the East Coast to WA. Or for any other percentage you want.

I am used to working in smaller States - WA, SA and Tassie. They all really don't like the big States. I get it.
.

 

[RSVKanga]

I dispute your assertions. If ME airlines lose out by not having scheduled non stops, they'll go for scheduling them.

What? I don’t really understand what point is being made here. Are you saying if Qatar Airways is losing out because of PER-LHR, they’d ask their semi-subsidiary BA to schedule their own PER-LHR?

 

[TY24]

And you seem to be ignoring the fact that the East coast has 80% of the population and WA 10%.
So if say 1% of the rest of the population not working in mining held OWE then there would be 8 times the OWEs on the East Coast to WA. Or for any other percentage you want.

I’m not ignoring any of it at all. All I’m saying is that the % of WA Frequent Flyer members who hold gold or above status is more than likely higher than other states.

I have no issues with any other states either, I lived in NSW quite happily for a number of years.

You keep completely ignoring or missing my point so lets just leave it there.

 

[AIRwin]

The old QF 23/24

This flight number pair has been recently freed up

 

[jase05]

Because only a very small minority chooses to fly one-stop with Hawaiian, AirNZ and FJ when travelling between Australia and the USA. The vast majority flies nonstop with QF or competitors also flying nonstop.

And the same will happen to Aus-Europe. It’s bound to happen.

It may take some time but it’s a matter of when, not if.


ME airlines will lose out and the competition QF will need to look out for will be the likes of BA, VS, AF and LH if they seek to start nonstop to Australia as well.

But what you’re missing is that QF will still only be serving at tops 5 or 6 European ports non stop. Every other destination in Europe is going to require a stop. QR serves over 60 ports in Europe so if you have a choice of a 1 stop on QF or 1 stop on QR then I dare say many would choose QR. For London, Paris and a couple of other destinations that QF will fly non stop that’s great but for others than the ME airlines will still have huge demand.
And that’s before you factor in the Australian ports that QF won’t offer non stop on. All well and good in PER/MEL/SYD but those in say BNE or ADL are for example going to need a 2 stop to get to somewhere like Prague or Zurich whereas they get a 1 stop flight on a ME airline.
There is plenty of room for all to survive

 

[RSVKanga]

BNE

Will absolutely have direct flights to Europe in time for the Olympics. I can’t see that not happening.

But what you’re missing is that QF will still only be serving at tops 5 or 6 European ports non stop. Every other destination in Europe is going to require a stop.

That’s exactly right. But those 5/6 ports will be the most popular ports for Europeans and Australians, which will take significant revenue away from the current ME stronghold on that corridor. Of course QR is and will continue to be the most appealing option for the extremely niche Adelaide to Zagreb market, but QR also currently has an advantage on the most popular markets (LHR, FCO, CDG, AMS, FRA) and that will change once QF flies nonstop to those cities and the market will heavily favour QF.

 

[jase05]

Will absolutely have direct flights to Europe in time for the Olympics. I can’t see that not happening.


That’s exactly right. But those 5/6 ports will be the most popular ports for Europeans and Australians, which will take significant revenue away from the current ME stronghold on that corridor. Of course QR is and will continue to be the most appealing option for the extremely niche Adelaide to Zagreb market, but QR also currently has an advantage on the most popular markets (LHR, FCO, CDG, AMS, FRA) and that will change once QF flies nonstop to those cities and the market will heavily favour QF.

Time will tell but I’m willing to bet that not much changes as i don’t believe QF will end up getting that many routes up and running.
QF will also charge a pretty penny for these non stop flights which many simply won’t pay the Premium. Even if you ignore the ME airlines are you going to pay say $3500 return in Economy on the QF non stop flight or $1800-2500 on one of the Asian carriers like Cathay or Malaysian?

 

[Digicola]

T3-T4 are already rabbit warrens and all the spaces are currently being utilised.

The Perth Airport must have agreed to expand the terminals to accommodate QF requests/needs. Presume will they expand the terminal from Gate 20.

Gates 25-35 are hard stands.

With Jetstar moving out they can gut out the checkin counters and effectively convert T3’s landside into a larger intl arrivals hall. Probably some space to push the walls of the lounge out a bit too.

 

[jrfsp]

With Jetstar moving out they can gut out the checkin counters and effectively convert T4’s landside into a larger intl arrivals hall. Probably some space to push the walls of the lounge out a bit too.

Is the separate security still there in T3 too, that could probably go too?

 

[Randel]

Looks like they need to upgrade sooner rather than later - refuelling problem since last night - all flights grounded, ours cancelled - 7am and still no news

 

[PERLHR]

Looks like they need to upgrade sooner rather than later - refuelling problem since last night - all flights grounded, ours cancelled - 7am and still no news

Yes...only at Perth eh!! What was meant to be a good news week has turned into a PR nightmare and embarassment. Could not make it up. Pax sitting on aircraft for hours after long flights, no parking bays, no fuel. Flights cancelled leaving pax confused and facing trips home at midnight. No contingency plan. Risk Management team if they exist should face the music!! A right mess.

Good luck!

 

[Randel]

That's what I said - where are contingency plans. So 8am Sat flight is now turning into a 5.35pm Sun flight - there goes two days of the holidays and accommodation.....

 

[RooFlyer]

Reasons why ME Airlines will quite happily survive and probably thrive even when and if Qantas gets it non-stop flights to Europe fully functioning:

* many frequent flyers, like me, like a stop in the middle of a journey to Europe, even overnight. In my case I insist on it.

* Qantas have said they will charge a premium for their non-stop flights and who can ever doubt them on that one? How much more are people willing to pay to save maybe five hours journey time on an inferior airline?

* if and when Qantas gets its full compliment of direct Europe flights up and running, ( and that's a big if) there are so many other places in Europe people want to fly to and in that case it’s still two legs on Qantas ( or three if you don't originate in the major ports). Within Europe, you’ll be flying on another airline for that final leg

Then, if you flew direct into London, the final leg will be back towards your origin on BA . If it's Rome or Paris, the final leg will have to be on a non-OneWorld airline!!

If you fly a ME airline, you can originate from Australia in more ports than the Qantas direct flights and you get two legs to your destination. All on the same airline.

* In case of irrops, the direct Qantas flights will probably have significant recovery problems because of Qantas being a relatively small airline globally and the deployment of it's suitable A350 aircraft.

* both the hard and soft product of Emirates and Qatar are so far ahead of Qantas it’s not funny.

Qantas will have a decent market for of direct flights ( if they materialise) but there’s many of us who will fly overseas two or three times a year and will stick to quality airlines, paying less for the privilege.

 

[Sprucegoose]

Nothing surprises me about Qantas Perth. They really are the laziest mob in the game. Their terminal is the worst in the country, significantly so when departing on International flights.

On my last trip, I flew in with VA and was impressed with their terminal.

Perth remains a city of two tales - it's very good when they get it right.

I still love ya, Perth!
.

 

[RSVKanga]

How much more are people willing to pay to save maybe five hours journey time on an inferior airline?

The exact same thing was said about PER-LHR in the lead up to its launch in March 2018.

It was all “it will last less than a year” pessimism and a desperate attempt supported and driven by the ME carrier camp, but the reality is PER-LHR turned out to be QF’s most profitable route in its history, and an ME carrier (EY) exited the Perth market shortly after. With this evidence, I think it’s safe to say the same thing will happen with Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane. We may not see full exits from ME airlines but there’s bound to be cutbacks while it’s QF and Australia’s time to shine.

Then, if you flew direct into London, the final leg will be back towards your origin on BA . If it's Rome or Paris, the final leg will have to be on a non-OneWorld airline!!

Ok? Qantas also has a well-established partnership with AF/KLM and they can just expand on that with connections from QF flights in CDG (and possibly AMS). That’s in addition to BA at LHR.

Qantas will have a decent market for of direct flights ( if they materialise) but there’s many of us who will fly overseas two or three times a year and will stick to quality airlines, paying less for the privilege.

Keep saying what you’re saying. Again, the exact same was said before PER-LHR launched.

if and when Qantas gets its full compliment of direct Europe flights up and running, ( and that's a big if) there are so many other places in Europe people want to fly to and in that case it’s still two legs on Qantas

It’s one stop to most airports in Europe. By 2032, I’d expect and SYD, MEL, BNE To have direct to at least LHR and probably CDG/AMS and it’s one stop connection to your final destination on a BA or AF/KLM flight. And your city doesn’t even have QR, or EK, or any international airline anyway (apart from NZ suspended). So 2-stop will remain for Tasmanians flying to smaller European cities regardless of whether they choose Sunrise or ME airlines. Not sure what your argument is here.

 

[Sprucegoose]

Qantas have said they will charge a premium for their non-stop flights and who can ever doubt them on that one? How much more are people willing to pay to save maybe five hours journey time on an inferior airline?

Qantas has craftily targeted the cash-rich and time-poor hence, I believe, on balance, the direct flights will be successful

both the hard and soft product of Emirates and Qatar are so far ahead of Qantas it’s not funny.

That's a strong statement, which I don't totally agree with. QF F and J seats are more comfortable on long haul than many others, including the Sandpit Airlines. Soft product, I can't disagree with you. Qantas must look at their catering—it is boring and unimaginative. NP is too long on the tooth. It really is a conservative position taken by Qantas and they desperately need the number for Do & Co.

Qantas will have a decent market for of direct flights ( if they materialise) but there’s many of us who will fly overseas two or three times a year and will stick to quality airlines, paying less for the privilege.

I agree, but there is no way on God's green earth that I will ever rush to Paris. Travel, for me, generally is about the journey and not the destination.