Qatar Airways to acquire 25% of Virgin Australia

[justinbrett]

If there was zero chance of switching to Avios, wouldn’t they say so when asked by a journo rather than refuse to answer, even by saying something vague like “we have no plans”?

Why answer a question that you don’t have to? Keep your opponents guessing.

 

[ben95]

The treasurer has said on ABC yesterday regarding the Qatar acqusition that "people should expect to see that decision quite soon, ideally this week".

 

[RooFlyer]

Now approved by the Treasurer - from the AFR app. Hooray!



EDIT: Now a link off the AFR web site

ASX 200 LIVE: ASX to slip, Qatar gets approval to buy Virgin stake, Qantas results awaited

Australian share futures turned negative after the US president reiterated his tariff-driven trade agenda. Qantas results pending. Follow updates here.

www.afr.com

 

[markis10]

Great timing - about 30 minutes before QF results come out

 

[RooFlyer]

Some of the conditions (from AFR article, above)

Chalmers said the airlines had committed to “a structured secondment program, placing 20 pilots and 40 cabin crew in Doha in 2025 to gain long-haul flying experience, while creating at least 60 backfill positions in Australia”.

They have also agreed to explore potential “dry lease” options, where Virgin Australia leases its own aircraft and provides its own crew, to begin no later than three years into the partnership and an assurance to unions that any future dry lease arrangements will utilise Australian-based labour.

“The proposal is also expected to deliver broader economic benefits including more job creation in Australia, support for the tourism industry and enhancing Australia’s position as a key travel hub,” Chalmers said.

 

[Saab34]

Agreed to ‘explore’

Funny.

 

[p--and--t]

Was interesting hearing pilots union chief saying part of the obligations of V2.0 was to re-establish international capability. So.there was a driver there to seriously make something happen (besides HND debacle).

 

[ben95]

Agreed to ‘explore’

Funny.

I mean it’s always going to be “explore” because you don’t necessarily want a repeat of VA1.0 but at the same time you don’t want VA/QR to do nothing and just sit on the wet lease forever.

Should the government be unhappy with the outcome of the exploration (say when there’s clearly a business case for it but VA refuses) then there’s action the government can take to “incentivize” them.

 

[justinbrett]

So not surprising it wasn't a binary decision but a question of what conditions were imposed.

I've got to say I'm surprised how much the wet lease is entangled in the acquisition - by rights they are mutually exclusive - a FIRB approval and wet lease DOH capacity denied, or FIRB denial but DOH capacity approved. Sounds like QR wanted an all or nothing deal and structured it this way. The condition on 3 years to get a dry lease is interesting, sounds like the government is saying you won't get another 5 - so you've got 3 years to make a decision and then 2 years to transition to a dry lease.

The bit about customers data is interesting (although I guess not surprising) - I assume QR will be blocked from VA customer data except for what is operationally required and/or QR has to show how they won't share data with the state of Qatar (a la TikTok/China).

 

[RooFlyer]

The condition on 3 years to get a dry lease is interesting, sounds like the government is saying you won't get another 5 - so you've got 3 years to make a decision and then 2 years to transition to a dry lease.

From well up thread:

Sure, and if the VA/QR wet lease was proposed to be forever, I would be against it. A couple of years, like Qantas would seem appropriate.

No, I’m not advising the Treasurer

The bit about customers data is interesting (although I guess not surprising) - I assume QR will be blocked from VA customer data except for what is operationally required and/or QR has to show how they won't share data with the state of Qatar (a la TikTok/China).

Yes, interesting. QR will almost certainly have board members or board members nominated by them and there will inevitably going to be be a lot of data in the board meeting notes. As you suggest, an undertaking by those people not to use the data outside proper purpose should be enough

 

[justinbrett]

Yes, interesting. QR will almost certainly have board members or board members nominated by them and there will inevitably going to be be a lot of data in the board meeting notes. As you suggest, an undertaking by those people not to use the data outside proper purpose should be enough

There was the condition for board member residency (must be Australian).

Doesn't clarify if they mean QR's representatives (like what FJ does to QF), or just that the VA board in total must have a certain percentage of Australians. (standard rule is 2 out of 3 must be Aussie) - but I'm not sure that would be a condition as it is a standard rule.

QR is a bit of an outlier in having Qatari CEOs - EK has a Brit, EY has a Kenyan (Brit before that, Aussie before that), RX a Brit (the same Brit from EY). Obviously a CEO is different to a board member (although usually gets a seat) just an observation that Qatar as been a bit more insular when it comes to appointments. Definitely doesn't work here though, VA must be seen to be an Australian airline being run by Australians or it will never succeed.

 

[zainman]

Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere or already in this thread but where exactly are QR getting the 777's to lease to VA from? Are they cutting frequencies on other routes? If so, which ones?

 

[Balad2005]

Qatar Airways approaches the landing strip on Virgin Australia stake

The deal, expected to be finalised within days, comes nearly 1½ years after Bain Capital delayed a billion-dollar public listing of the Australian airline.

www.afr.com

Just been reported in the AFR. Expect to see the formal announcement by end of the week.

Well the runway is now clear for landing.

'More affordable': Travellers expected to win from the Qatar-Virgin Australia deal

Australian travellers could face cheaper airfares after Qatar Airways' 25 per cent stake in Virgin Australia was approved by the federal government.

www.abc.net.au

 

[elanshin]

Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere or already in this thread but where exactly are QR getting the 777's to lease to VA from? Are they cutting frequencies on other routes? If so, which ones?

They would probably reshuffle their fleet in a heartbeat to service Australia because we probably generate them a much higher profit margin than many other lower socio economic regions as well to grow the brand in Australia with their premium products.

(This is probably why we don't hear as much about the QSuite problem as other parts of the world).

 

[zainman]

They would probably reshuffle their fleet in a heartbeat to service Australia because we probably generate them a much higher profit margin than many other lower socio economic regions as well to grow the brand in Australia with their premium products.

(This is probably why we don't hear as much about the QSuite problem as other parts of the world).

Yep I agree.

I was wondering what parts of their network they are trimming though. Do you know how many 777 they will need to spare to run the extra flights for VA?

 

[elanshin]

Yep I agree.

I was wondering what parts of their network they are trimming though. Do you know how many 777 they will need to spare to run the extra flights for VA?

I think that's hard to predict. Given at the best of times right now you don't necessarily know which plane is going to show up at your gate in other parts of the world with QR.

 

[zainman]

Qatar Airways NS25 Service Changes — AeroRoutes

Published at 1700GMT 19FEB25 Qatar Airways up to this week filed various changes to its planned operation during Northern summer 2025 season, between 30MAR25 and 25OCT25. Latest adjustment as of 18FEB25 includes the following. Doha – Algiers eff 30MAR25 1 daily A330-300 service maintained, re

www.aeroroutes.com

I think that's hard to predict. Given at the best of times right now you don't necessarily know which plane is going to show up at your gate in other parts of the world with QR.

I can't see many changes in equipment from 777 to others

 

[elanshin]

Qatar Airways NS25 Service Changes — AeroRoutes

Published at 1700GMT 19FEB25 Qatar Airways up to this week filed various changes to its planned operation during Northern summer 2025 season, between 30MAR25 and 25OCT25. Latest adjustment as of 18FEB25 includes the following. Doha – Algiers eff 30MAR25 1 daily A330-300 service maintained, re

www.aeroroutes.com

I can't see many changes in equipment from 777 to others

There's the official publications. But who knows if that plane will show up. There's a reason QR is infamous (and even has a policy these days about equipment changes).

 

[markis10]

JH is on ABC Sydney shortly with Chris Bath