QFF Ideas & Suggestions

[NM]

To an extent. I think that getting comped once is fine. There can be a variety of reasons why someone might have a "slow" year of air travel. Getting comped 2 or 3 years running is a joke IMO.

If you have a quiet year and don't qualify Platinum, then you will be Gold. Seems reasonable to me.

I am not going to requalify AA Exec Platinum next year, so am perfectly expecting to be downgraded to Platinum. I have no reason to expect I should be comped status which I have not earned.

 

[NM]

Hi NM.

I don't think ANYTHING, aside from larger lounges will prevent overcrowding. I was being a bit tongue in cheek with my post.

I still think that increasing the number of qualifying sectors will help adress Red Roo's initial initial request for suggestions.

Still need to be careful. Someone doing 3 return trips SYD-LHR-SYD in F in a year is going to be a very valuable customer to Qantas as far as revenue is concerned. So with only 6 sectors they would not be able to qualify Platinum? Perhaps a minimum number of SC's earned on QF may be a feasible way to go about it? Such that its 20 short domestic discount economy segments, or 10 short domestic full economy segments, or 4 business or first class segments? Say a minimum 200 SCs on QF flights.

 

[markis10]

It your example, you say that double SC got you to PG, but wouldn't have got you to WP. But isn't the jump from WP to PG the same as the jump from SG to WP?

I said without it I would have made WP anyway, it just put me up to PG, the difference is not the same, 1400-600 = 800 SCs while 2100-1400=700 SCs. Its the same gap if you are trying to attain that level for the first time, that is 700SCs, but I have been SG or WP since the enhancements of 1998.

 

[dfcatch]

Having agreed with practically everything medhead,oneworldplus and markis have said right throughout this thread - i think there are a few main points here.

And they all relate to the topic at hand - suggestions to improve the QFF program:

1/ Ease of qualification both in terms of raw SC's to achieve/retain, and also in terms of qualifying flights;

2/ Whether the offering of promos such as double-SC or comping status devalues the achievement for others;

3/ The perceived devaluing of benefits and the effect on loyalty;

4/ The effect of "frequent spenders" on the program and the resultant effects such as cost to QF, ability of members to redeem, and the potential influx of frequent spenders becoming status holders due to SC earn on JASA's.

As a SFSC I also acknowledge that those who are self-funded may feel more devalued from time to time as you always do whenever you spend your own money.
At the risk of being controversial - the flip-side is that those who get to fly regularly in premium cabins as a result of someone else paying (ie. their employer) may feel a sense of entitlement and consider increasing numbers of status pax to be devaluing their "entitlements".

FWIW - IMHO I don't begrudge an occasional promotion ( I just hope I might benefit one day). I also don't begrudge the once status comp. I'm sure I may need it at some point and know that it may go a long way to maintaining my loyalty beyond a quiet year.

Remembering also that whilst the increased qualifying segments may assist in minimising those who only hold status due to YUPs etc, QF still receives revenue for those flights on other carriers being credited to QF.

 

[Oneworldplus2]

If you have a quiet year and don't qualify Platinum, then you will be Gold. Seems reasonable to me.

I am not going to requalify AA Exec Platinum next year, so am perfectly expecting to be downgraded to Platinum. I have no reason to expect I should be comped status which I have not earned.

I see where your coming from, but sometimes it's good to get a little bit of lee-way as a customer too. This can also build loyalty. Say l have been WP for 6 years running, during the GFC, my travel was slashed by 70%. If QF did comp me WP during the GFC, l would have appreciated that (and seen it as a sign of goodwill). With some massive changes in the pipeline for DJ, that comped WP might keep me from switching over to the competitor? Like l said in a post before, comping people for more than 1 year seems silly to me, or in a case like yours NM, 0 SC's YTD.

 

[dfcatch]

Still need to be careful. Someone doing 3 return trips SYD-LHR-SYD in F in a year is going to be a very valuable customer to Qantas as far as revenue is concerned. So with only 6 sectors they would not be able to qualify Platinum? Perhaps a minimum number of SC's earned on QF may be a feasible way to go about it? Such that its 20 short domestic discount economy segments, or 10 short domestic full economy segments, or 4 business or first class segments? Say a minimum 200 SCs on QF flights.

Quite reasonable to me - similar to the NZ model, although their's requires a much larger percentage to be on NZ metal.

200 SC on QF metal is not unreasonable.

 

[medhead]

I said without it I would have made WP anyway, it just put me up to PG, the difference is not the same, 1400-600 = 800 SCs while 2100-1400=700 SCs. Its the same gap if you are trying to attain that level for the first time, that is 700SCs, but I have been SG or WP since the enhancements of 1998.

Sorry, I didn't read the "without" properly.

FWIW - IMHO I don't begrudge an occasional promotion ( I just hope I might benefit one day). I also don't begrudge the once status comp. I'm sure I may need it at some point and know that it may go a long way to maintaining my loyalty beyond a quiet year.

I also what to be very clear that I'm not suffering from the Green Eye monster on this one. I'm happy for everyone else who gets promos.

 

[Jobu]

1. Give us a real incentive beyond 1200 SCs re-qualifying for Platinum to keep directing all of our traffic to Qantas.

Right now, I hit Partner Gold and then max-out two other frequent flyer programmes (I seem to get better treatment with the other programmes, such as regular upgrades (no upgrades with Qantas), cheaper redemptions, but I am sentimental towards Qantas because of the Australia thing).

If you had something attractive to attain at say 2500 or 3000 SCs (e.g. partner platinum, Chairman's Lounge, free upgrades, free flights, new status level, personalised gift etc) I imagine you would see more "loyalty". The bottles of Grange are nice but how about something in-between?

2. A reason to keep flying Qantas beyond Lifetime Gold (14,000 SCs). What about Lifetime Platinum?

3. Not FF related, but your amenity kits need alot of work compared to the competition! (the packaging of the recent new cards/tags was however impressive)

4. Car / limo service? (e.g. Emirates)

5. Where available (e.g. empty flights) block the seat next door for more space and privacy?

My battery is about to die, I'll be back.

Cheers,

JOBU

 

[samh004]

2. A reason to keep flying Qantas beyond Lifetime Gold (14,000 SCs). What about Lifetime Platinum?

You’d think it wouldn’t be hard to offer at 30,000SC’s or so, after all, the majority of people that get there will have dedicated a lot of money to Qantas and the whole alliance, and are likely to keep doing so, but also, no one lives forever, so there’d never be that many that could be a "burden", surely?

 

[Oneworldplus2]

2. A reason to keep flying Qantas beyond Lifetime Gold (14,000 SCs). What about Lifetime Platinum?
JOBU

Good idea.

Maybe SC that have been earned on QF, Jetstar, National Jet &
Qantas Link count. Like UA 's Million Mile BIS program?

 

[simongr]

Still need to be careful. Someone doing 3 return trips SYD-LHR-SYD in F in a year is going to be a very valuable customer to Qantas as far as revenue is concerned.

The same would apply even for a J pax - three returns to the UK would be $25K(ish) and about 125 red-e-deals to MEL - I have a reasonable idea which would be more profitable to QF...

 

[TonyHancock]

The same would apply even for a J pax - three returns to the UK would be $25K(ish) and about 125 red-e-deals to MEL - I have a reasonable idea which would be more profitable to QF...

Indeed!

I think the criteria would need to be SC's earned on QF Metal as NM suggested. That way there is at least some kind of weighting. I think 200 is a little low TBH.

 

[medhead]

The same would apply even for a J pax - three returns to the UK would be $25K(ish) and about 125 red-e-deals to MEL - I have a reasonable idea which would be more profitable to QF...

If we assume that qantas has done the sums correctly they would be about equally profitable as they both gain similar status related benefits. 1440 SC vs 1250 SC

 

[JohnK]

Very interesting thread.

Here are some of my suggestions in no particular order.

1) Bring back Upgrade Credits instead of the measly 5,000 point Loyalty Bonus for every 450 SC's. Another idea could be to give each status level a certain number of upgrade credits at reassessment date, eg Partner Gold 8 UC's or more based on SC's earned, Platinum 6 UC's, Gold 3 UC's and Silver 1 UC. From memory 3 UC's were sufficient to upgrade a SYD-SIN/BKK/HKG flight.

2) Allow confirmed points upgrades (or using Upgrade credits) on international flights on any fare class for Platinum, Gold and Silver. Perhaps restrict the number of points upgrades available at T-353 days and release more closer to the time of the flight.

3) Spare middle seats should be in rows 4-10 on a 738 and not in rows 11-29.

4) Block some forward aisle and window seats for late bookings. I liked the fact that QF looked after me when my SIN-MEL flight was going to be 3 hours late and I would miss my connection and QF rebooked me onto a later flight and allocated for me 27D on a 767.

5) Ensure that if op-ups are required on any given flight that Platinums and Golds get them before Silver and Bronze members. Loyalty should be rewarded in these situations not left up to pot luck.

6) Allow Platinums to pre-allocate exit rows on international flights free of charge.

7) Restore anytime access to lounges for Platinums

8) Keep a track of how points are earned in each QFF account and if booking awards using points earned from flying then reduce the number of points required for the award and also remove fuel surcharges for these award bookings. Perhaps a sliding scale can be used depending on the percentage of how the points were earned.

9) Allow selection of fare class when booking a multi-city itinerary. At the moment it defaults to the lowest fare class available on the flight where as the point to point airfares allow the selection of Sale, Super Saver, Fully Flexible etc for each leg.

 

[samh004]

8) Keep a track of how points are earned in each QFF account and if booking awards using points earned from flying then reduce the number of points required for the award and also remove fuel surcharges for these award bookings. Perhaps a sliding scale can be used depending on the percentage of how the points were earned.

Your 8th point is actually very smart (not implying that your not, just a really good idea), however considering their focus on EDR, I doubt they'd want shoppers thinking their points were worth less than those that actually fly

 

[ejb]

If QANTAS is SERIOUSLY concerned about overcrowding due to "anytime access" by WP's.... Here's a hint. Instead of increasing the SC's needed to attain WP or remove the benefit.... Increase the number of "sectors flown" requirement, from 4 to 20! Having been a VERY loyal QF customer for many years, I HATE to see my benefits continually eroded!

As it stands now. One could potentially obtain WP on the back of 2 return MEL - ADL red-e-deals (less than $400) and a couple of status runs in the USA.

I like this idea. QF could look at making a new top tier only reachable with QF/J* SC's to reward the pax that actually fly QF and this would not impact those earning SC's on other carriers, as they would still be able to reach WP with 4 sectors and 1200 SC'c. Leave the levels where they are but if you earn, say 1000 SC's just on QF/J*(while still having 1200 SC total) you get WP+ which grants you anytime access and other selected extras as a thank you for flying the Roo.

Just my thoughts.

ejb

 

[Oneworldplus2]

What about the road warriors that travel in whY, but still achieve a high SC count each year? If QF were to change to a Singapore Airline style program, I most probably wouldn't get status.

 

[ejb]

What about the road warriors that travel in whY, but still achieve a high SC count each year? If QF were to change to a Singapore Airline style program, I most probably wouldn't get status.

I had thought about the SQ system but this is one reason I think that a QF SC count would be fairer.

Those traveling in Y could still get status. Perhaps QF could reward all FF's at all levels if they have acheived the status on QF alone.

ejb

 

[ComeFlyWithMe]

I think people are underestimating the way 'loyalty' programs work.

If you are a WP, you are more likely to book travel with QF, due to the enhanced benefits you receive. By having more WPs, QF are in effect increasing sales due to this loyalty factor - why would I go and start from scratch on Singapore when I already get benefits from QF?

I got the double SC promo, and did fly more because of it, earning QF additional revenue. This got me to WP for 19 months (was happy at SG), however next status year I will easily requalify as I have forward bookings all on QF - not the cheapest, however I chose to fly QF due to my WP status. They win. I win.

I personally agree 4 sectors is too low to be considered a 'frequent flyer' at any level of the program.

Everyone keeps whining about anytime lounge access, but I would suspect that less than 1% of WPs would actually use this benefit (most appear to be on AFF). Personally, if I'm not flying, why the heck would I want to be in an airport? Most of my pickups/drop-offs are at T2 anyway, so no J lounge regardless.

In addition, do you think the J lounge staff are going to start scrutinising boarding passes closely? They're far too busy, nor would they really care (attitude can be an issue at times - not as bad as QP staff however). Flash your card - you will most likely be in, or use your guest's boarding pass and your card.

As far as cost saving measures, I can't imagine this is a particularly costly benefit - although there are probably some that abuse it - like those I hear on AFF that make a trip out there on Friday nights for free booze :shock: -frankly I'm glad this is coming to an end, they clog up the lounge for those of us actually travelling...! Who'd have thought top tier members and premium pax could be so cheap. I suppose class can't be bought.

 

[simongr]

Very interesting thread.

Here are some of my suggestions in no particular order.

1) Bring back Upgrade Credits instead of the measly 5,000 point Loyalty Bonus for every 450 SC's. Another idea could be to give each status level a certain number of upgrade credits at reassessment date, eg Partner Gold 8 UC's or more based on SC's earned, Platinum 6 UC's, Gold 3 UC's and Silver 1 UC. From memory 3 UC's were sufficient to upgrade a SYD-SIN/BKK/HKG flight.

2) Allow confirmed points upgrades (or using Upgrade credits) on international flights on any fare class for Platinum, Gold and Silver. Perhaps restrict the number of points upgrades available at T-353 days and release more closer to the time of the flight.

3) Spare middle seats should be in rows 4-10 on a 738 and not in rows 11-29.

5) Ensure that if op-ups are required on any given flight that Platinums and Golds get them before Silver and Bronze members. Loyalty should be rewarded in these situations not left up to pot luck.

I really like these ideas. I especially like the blocked middle seats starting at the front idea. I actually think that would be unpopular with the less frequent traveller but also less noticed by those same travellers.

8) Keep a track of how points are earned in each QFF account and if booking awards using points earned from flying then reduce the number of points required for the award

I see where you are coming from on this but I think a more elegant solution would be to provide more points for actually flying and higher status bonuses on QF. this would certainly sway me towards QF when flying.

As an example on my next UK trip ordinarily I would default to flying CX as I prefer to fly them. However having now started racking up points again I will probably move travel around to get on an A380 (assuming they fly again ) to enjoy a higher earn rate.

Just before my comment let me first state that I don't care either about anytime access. Never used it and never likely to have used it

Everyone keeps whining about anytime lounge access, but I would suspect that less than 1% of WPs would actually use this benefit (most appear to be on AFF).

As far as cost saving measures, I can't imagine this is a particularly costly benefit

This is the problem most people are having. This is thought to be a very minimal direct cost (and we can argue for days on the indirect cost to QF of people flying other carriers knowing they can still access the lounge) and no real impact on lounge access - so why bother pi55ing off people when they didnt need to? This is core of the outrage I think.