Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Bahrain and UAE cut diplomatic ties with Qatar.

[Himeno]

Sorry Himeno; its not unusual, let us say. I took the Iran/Turkey track to Europe on QR last year. The western flights of QR over Saudi went to north Africa; those to Europe go via Iran and Turkish airspace. The image in post #36 was before the Saudi airspace ban came in.

I'm not talking about just flights to/from Europe.
QR flights, just 24 hours ago, to parts of Southern Europe, Africa, South America, Australia and parts of Asia were flying through Saudi or UAE airspace, while flights to the rest of Europe and North America headed north over Iran, then Turkey to Europe and Russia towards the pole and North America.
Now every QR flight is heading north into Iran before turning off towards their destination (which in the case of African and South American flights means flying south over Oman and Yemen before heading west).

 

[hossein_au]

As per a recent post though, it's fairly hard to find Shiraz in Shiraz (wine that is, not the carpets).

Like anything else in life, you gotta know people who know people ;-)

 

[hossein_au]

Have a read of these 2 articles

One article says that the final straw that broke the camel's back per the FT was Qatar paying US$1bn to (Iran?) to secure the release of some members of the royal family kidnapped in Iraq

The Shocking Trigger Behind Today's Gulf Scandal: Qatar Paid Al-Qaeda, Iran $1BN In Hostage Deal | Zero Hedge

The other deals with the dominance of Qatari gas

https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/...-with-qatar-has-22-year-history-rooted-in-gas

I'd take the first article with a (huge) grain of salt: Iran and Al Qaeda are opposing forces; they are indeed polar opposites and at direct flight (war) in Iraq.

 

[jenib]

I'm not talking about just flights to/from Europe.
QR flights, just 24 hours ago, to parts of Southern Europe, Africa, South America, Australia and parts of Asia were flying through Saudi or UAE airspace, while flights to the rest of Europe and North America headed north over Iran, then Turkey to Europe and Russia towards the pole and North America.
Now every QR flight is heading north into Iran before turning off towards their destination (which in the case of African and South American flights means flying south over Oman and Yemen before heading west).

Hi Himeno, I noted in post #57 this
"According to Flightradar24, Bahrain sent notified pilots that it will limit flights to and from Qatar by Qatari aircraft through its airspace to a single air route. This means, even if Qatar Airways isn’t grounded, it will be subject to heavy air traffic congestion." (from the article)

So it doesn't sound normal to me

 

[RooFlyer]

I'm not talking about just flights to/from Europe.
QR flights, just 24 hours ago, to parts of Southern Europe, Africa, South America, Australia and parts of Asia were flying through Saudi or UAE airspace, while flights to the rest of Europe and North America headed north over Iran, then Turkey to Europe and Russia towards the pole and North America.
Now every QR flight is heading north into Iran before turning off towards their destination (which in the case of African and South American flights means flying south over Oman and Yemen before heading west).

I think we are in agreement for the most part, aren't we? I wasn't talking just about flights to Europe either, just responding to sunstar320's query :

Outbound QR Flights all seem to be heading on the same track over Iran, EK/EY both head up the Persian gulf. Not sure if this is normal?

That is normal (QR on an immediate track over Iran, EK/EY tracking up the gulf before transiting over Iran). Now, there is a second QR corridor peeling off to the east immediately and flying over the Straits of Hormuz to reach destinations to the immediate west south-east and east.




Interestingly, EY at least is still flying directly over Qatar (eg ETD44A = EY102 right now).

 

[moa999]

Look likes the corridor is roughly NE from Doha to Iran airspace.

Interestingly EY is still overlying Qatar

 

[Himeno]

I think we are in agreement for the most part, aren't we? I wasn't talking just about flights to Europe either, just responding to sunstar320's query :


That is normal (QR on an immediate track over Iran, EK/EY tracking up the gulf before transiting over Iran). Now, there is a second QR corridor peeling off to the east immediately and flying over the Straits of Hormuz to reach destinations to the immediate west south-east and east.

Tracking over Iran is normal for DOH flights to Europe and North America. It is not normal for QR flights elsewhere.

 

[ermen]

I'd take the first article with a (huge) grain of salt: Iran and Al Qaeda are opposing forces; they are indeed polar opposites and at direct flight (war) in Iraq.

That is what I thought too - but the FT is a credible news outlet.
Hard to see through the very murky alliances and feuds through that region...

 

[Melburnian1]

How much extra running time will this add to particular flights by destination or origin?

Bump (although I note comment above that many routes may be unaffected.)

 

[defurax]

Bump (although I note comment above that many routes may be unaffected.)

I looked at JNB and it seems it only adds about 5 minutes looking at the average of the past few weeks. Although the DOH-JNB route already wasn't direct due to the war in Yemen. Seems like DOH-CMN and other airports in the Maghreb will be the most affected.

 

[muppet]

This may be a smidge OT - but does anyone know why Bahrain's airspace is so huge and completely surrounds Qatar?

How is airspace not limited to the air above your territory?? I there no "international airspace"?

 

[Daver6]

I think shorter flights like Doha to Larnaca will have a significant percentage increase.

 

[defurax]

I think shorter flights like Doha to Larnaca will have a significant percentage increase.

Surprisingly not, as the previous flight path to LCA was avoiding Jordan and Israel and so the flight time is the same as going over Iran and Turkey.

 

[samh004]

This may be a smidge OT - but does anyone know why Bahrain's airspace is so huge and completely surrounds Qatar?

How is airspace not limited to the air above your territory?? I there no "international airspace"?

I wondered that myself, though it's very hard to find information as all search results are about the current dramas.

In my searching I did find this lovely map: http://www.bahrainaims.com/eAIP/Publications/AIRAC06-17/2016-08-18-AIRAC/graphics/9339.pdf

Not that it would be responsible, but I wonder what would happen if they just said "no, we're going to use a bit more airspace than you have given us" and muscled their way into the sky. I can imagine Saudi shooting a passenger plane down over their airspace, but I can't see Bahrain or UAE willing to take the gamble. Can't just point at Ukraine like Russia did, the eyes of the world would be very condemning!

Wont happen, I'm just speculating that it's a big leap from banning them from your airspace and shooting down a plane.

 

[Himeno]

This may be a smidge OT - but does anyone know why Bahrain's airspace is so huge and completely surrounds Qatar?

How is airspace not limited to the air above your territory?? I there no "international airspace"?

Why does Melbourne FIR control half the Indian Ocean?
Why does Oakland control half the North Pacfic? ;P

 

[Scr77]

Qatar in 'chaos' as Arab powers halt food supply to country amid diplomatic rift - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

 

[Tiki]

We did WDH-DOH-ADL in J last month (best ever use of AA miles). It looks like there is minimal disruption to both these routes. WDH-DOH was only 34 minutes late from having to skirt around the UAE. DOH-ADL was spot on time, even arrived a bit early. The Aussie routes were probably already being routed over Iran.

The GRU-DOH route got royally screwed, has to route via ATH for re-fuelling. I wish they would tag GRU onto one of the Aussie flights instead, it would be so nice to not have to transit SCL (dreaming, I know)!

 

[alieninperth]

Qatari nationals being denied boarding on QF flights to DXB

https://www.theguardian.com/busines...be-allowed-on-flights-via-dubai-after-uae-ban

Airline says it will offer ‘alternatives’ to affected passengers after Arab powers cut ties with Gulf state

 

[Strategic Aviation]

An interesting aside:-

Further, it was announced Qatar Airways chief executive Akbar Al Baker would be the next IATA chairman, following Goh’s one-year term.

 

[AviatorPJ]

Whilst the Saudis closing their order would amount to a land blockade (being the only land border), I haven't seen ANY mention of sea one. That would mean closing the Straits of Hormuz for Qatari bound chips of all nations, requiring the co-operation of Iran.

Also, the cooperation of Oman.