The totally off-topic thread

[whatmeworry]

Actually IMHO it has nothing to do with money.

It's a lot easier to lobby and/or put pressure on a couple of hundred elected representatives than it is to to lobby the populace.

Like the Chinese government donating via their citizens/state companies to political parties in Australia.

 

[marki]

Burkini police got scrapped

 

[JohnK]

Episode 6 well under way. That is 3 episodes this week and only a few hours after going home. Can't take much more.

 

[medhead]

Actually IMHO it has nothing to do with money.

It's a lot easier to lobby and/or put pressure on a couple of hundred elected representatives than it is to to lobby the populace.

The question of whether to conduct the vote has a lot to do with efficient use of taxes. I agree that the issue to be voted on, itself, has nothing to do with money. But why waste $xx_ million of taxpayer money when it looks like those lobbied couple of hundred representatives will decide anyway?

 

[RooFlyer]

I will save Steady the question..WTF is TKWIA ? They know who I am
This kind woman is after me
the Krug was indeed awful

somehow I reckon one of these is correct BIWBOI.

I guess you would also struggle with. YMWSTMBICPC.

 

[drron]

Well today SKWIW as whilst having lunch on the Silver Whisper a couple came up and said you must be drron.

 

[Pushka]

So we should not be worried about harming children when they are in the tiny minority?

Given this plebiscite is Government funded, then any advertising Yay or Nay is funded by the Government. By us. If the experience of Ireland comes into play here then we are all responsible.

On the other hand I do agree that we are becoming too sensitive to stuff that happens and we are losing resilience as a result. Fremantle Council stopping fireworks on Australia Day is an example. I am insulted that they have decided as an Institution that European settlement was an invasion.

Well today SKWIW as whilst having lunch on the Silver Whisper a couple came up and said you must be drron.

Ah. Better mind your P's and Q's. We have a spy!

 

[cove]

I believe that vote for ending the Fremantle fireworks only had one against and something like eleven for.

 

[RooFlyer]

Regardless of sides, or views. I don't think the issue is giving 20 million people a vote. More that the proposed plebiscite is looking to be a big waste of money, with a large number of politicians saying they wouldn't support the legislation if the public does say yes. Meaning it gets back to a conscience vote in parliament. So why waste $xx_ millions, just do the conscience vote in parliament - that costs nothing extra. The majority public view is pretty much known as well from polling, but there is zero point in asking everyones opinion if they aren't going to implement that view any way.

Its an interesting philosophical question isn't it? (irrespective of the topic in question)

On the one hand "Let the politicians decide ... that's what they are there for"; on the other hand "Hang on, this isn't a 'government / governance' issue, its overturning umpteen hundreds of years of convention, and the people might actually not agree with the majority who have their backsides on the leather this year".

In general, although I do trust the government (as opposed to politicians), if it comes down to a vote of the people vs a vote in parliament (which is exactly what is being debated at the moment), I go for a vote of the people.

I recall the republic referendum (yes, I know its a plebiscite this time, not a referendum) - how loud was noise and 'public support' for a republic .. "..everyone I know is going to vote yes ..." etc. And the republic went down in a screaming heap. Sometimes the media noise and support, and opinion polls didn't reflect the true public opinion. On controversial issues, people in opinion polls tend to give the answer they think is the "right" one, as dictated by the media noise, rather than what they truly believe.

I suspect that the resistance to a public vote is that the pro-change group suspect that the public vote will go against them. The arguments about a possible hate campaign is just scare tactics and speculation. I think we got through the vote to include Aboriginal persons in the census and to allow the commonwealth government to make laws for them without dissolving into a foam-flecked rabble.

And the waste of money issue? Some say the Royal Commission into Institutional responses to child abuse was a waste of money. Police have the powers to investigate all that stuff, so why waste time and money on a RC? (NB I don't agree with that proposition - there were wider issues at stake). Its always a balance between general good and practicality.

I think supporters of the proposal should embrace a public vote. If they win, as they say they will, then that will settle the issue: no come-back, no more debate. Most of the current pollies appear to support it so game, set, match. If the politicians vote their personal opinions then the issue will NOT be settled in a large slice of the publics mind, and it will continue to fester.

 

[Pushka]

I believe that vote for ending the Fremantle fireworks only had one against and something like eleven for.

Did they ask the people who pay for it and enjoy it?

The Republican referendum was never going to be a Yes. Ask the question in a particular way to get the answer you want.

 

[Bindibuys]

Heading to Sydney today. American Football at Homebush this afternoon, then Cirque du Soleil tonight. City shopping tomorrow. Big weekend for me.

 

[TomVexille]

Heading to Sydney today. American Football at Homebush this afternoon, then Cirque du Soleil tonight. City shopping tomorrow. Big weekend for me.

Enjoy the game

 

[love_the_life]

When are you off o's BB​? Must be soon or have I missed it

 

[RooFlyer]

Did they ask the people who pay for it and enjoy it?

The Republican referendum was never going to be a Yes. Ask the question in a particular way to get the answer you want.

The question was, in terms of republic model offered, agreed by the clear majority of republic supporters at the Constitutional Convention beforehand . I still enjoy the memory of Turnbull and most of the rest of the republic camp wildly clapping and celebrating when John Howard announced the referendum at the end of the Convention.

The fact that the republic supporters split into several camps afterwards was their problem. Memo to Turnbull: John Howard didn't break the country's heart ... the people over whelming voted for the outcome, and Turnbull at that point demonstrated his total tin ear to what the country, outside his eastern suburbs electorate, thinks.

And of course as far as the gay marriage plebiscite is concerned, Turnbull took that policy to the last election - and won (yes, only just, but a win's a win). Now, we don't want our pollies to break their election promises, do we? And of course the Greens also supported a gay marriage plebiscite not long ago ...

 

[mannej]

Episode 6 well under way. That is 3 episodes this week and only a few hours after going home. Can't take much more.

Hang in there John. I know each episode is quite scary but it's not long to go now.

 

[Pushka]

Election promises are interesting. Whichever way you vote, for that party there are some promises you agree with and some you dont. Voting for whatever side doesn't mean you agree with all promises but you just hate them less than 'the other side'. But the story then becomes 'thats the promise you voted for'.

 

[mannej]

Did they ask the people who pay for it and enjoy it?

The Republican referendum was never going to be a Yes. Ask the question in a particular way to get the answer you want.

The other issue here it is a joint event with another LGA, so there will be cost breaking the agreement.

 

[Pushka]

The other issue here it is a joint event with another LGA, so there will be cost breaking the agreement.

That will be an interesting play out then. Hadn't read of that. The Council said it wasn't a cost cutting exercise and the funds were to be put to more inclusive events.

 

[RooFlyer]

That will be an interesting play out then. Hadn't read of that. The Council said it wasn't a cost cutting exercise and the funds were to be put to more inclusive events.

"More inclusive " ... Is that what they are saying? More inclusive than being Australian, then?

 

[RooFlyer]

Election promises are interesting. Whichever way you vote, for that party there are some promises you agree with and some you dont. Voting for whatever side doesn't mean you agree with all promises but you just hate them less than 'the other side'. But the story then becomes 'thats the promise you voted for'.

yep, agree with that. But as you can't generally separate out the various promises ( the GST election a notable exception) , the elected government is entitled to claim a mandate for them all. I thought it was funny that after the last result, Shirtenwas claiming a 'mandate from Labor voters' for his policies.