Tokyo Haneda slot - how will Virgin Operate it?

[PERLHR]

I got my email yesterday and then called and rescheduled it (brought it forward).

My flight was one of the ones axed prior to Feb 25..(Sept this year). Anyway called VA, spoke to a lovely lady and we managed to come away with a rather good result after some discussion!

Bottom line, same days but routing on VA metal ex PER to SYD and then onward with ANA and back. Good result.

 

[AIRwin]

When will VA actually inform customers of flight cancellations or changes? Still no e mail from them received with alternatives. Are they really that amateurish? All over the media, but no official notification! Pathetic.

I was going to suggest calling VA but you beat me to it...

 

[PERLHR]

I was going to suggest calling VA but you beat me to it...

Don't speak to soon. They have contacted me again and said...they have made a mistake. Watch this space.

 

[simmomelb]

My flight was one of the ones axed prior to Feb 25..(Sept this year). Anyway called VA, spoke to a lovely lady and we managed to come away with a rather good result after some discussion!

Bottom line, same days but routing on VA metal ex PER to SYD and then onward with ANA and back. Good result.

V happy to hear this, I hope you have a wonderful time in Japan

 

[sudoer]

They have contacted me again and said...they have made a mistake.

Uh oh...

 

[simmomelb]

Don't speak to soon. They have contacted me again and said...they have made a mistake. Watch this space.

Waiting with bated breath.

 

[PERLHR]

Uh oh...

Couldn't make it up. Found them hard to understand also....so anyway they are away to.think again. Jeez they have even issued me with an e ticket etc for the flight with ANA ....seemed tbe saying that it has to be VA operated flights only ....(Well I said it's a VA flight number) And I'm assuming there is no direct operated flights with VA except the CNS flight that they have cancelled. Seriously, worse than Ryanair. ,

 

[simmomelb]

The will fix this, sit tight

 

[sudoer]

Couldn't make it up. Found them hard to understand also....so anyway they are away to.think again. Jeez they have even issued me with an e ticket etc for the flight with ANA ....seemed tbe saying that it has to be VA operated flights only ....(Well I said it's a VA flight number) And I'm assuming there is no direct operated flights with VA except the CNS flight that they have cancelled. Seriously, worse than Ryanair. ,

Have you got travel insurance?

 

[Mattg]

Agree with all your good points there, although ANA continued flying between Australia and Japan even throughout Covid, so that seems to me that they have a solid commitment to the market for some reason and/or there must be some money in it, considering they are competing against JL JQ and QF in the direct AUS-JPN market. Their loads may be light, but maybe they can extract decent yields? and maybe freight comes into it? Their overall cost base in Japan would be now very competitive against Qantas and Jetstars cost base in Australia due to the posts above talking about exchange rates and static wages in Japan compared to the runaway inflation, wages growth and higher AUD.

Keep in mind that the load factors don't account for (and can be very different to) yields.

While ANA's load factors are a bit less than the other airlines, they may be charging the highest fares and making good money overall. The passenger load factors also don't account for cargo, which can pay well.

The problem for VA is that they have poor load factors, not amazing yields (they don't even have lie-flat business seats to sell on board) and probably little to no cargo due to the aircraft type being used.

 

[PERLHR]

Have you got travel insurance?

Yes..but at the moment that is not the point.

 

[henrus]

I need to figure out some time to go to Japan before this route ends. Flying VA to Japan is unlikely to be something they’ll do again, likewise flying a 737 from Australia to Japan is something we’re unlikely to see again in the future.

 

[Himeno]

I need to figure out some time to go to Japan before this route ends. Flying VA to Japan is unlikely to be something they’ll do again, likewise flying a 737 from Australia to Japan is something we’re unlikely to see again in the future.

There's always JQ when the A321XLRs arrive.

 

[elanshin]

Keep in mind that the load factors don't account for (and can be very different to) yields.

While ANA's load factors are a bit less than the other airlines, they may be charging the highest fares and making good money overall. The passenger load factors also don't account for cargo, which can pay well.

The problem for VA is that they have poor load factors, not amazing yields (they don't even have lie-flat business seats to sell on board) and probably little to no cargo due to the aircraft type being used.

NH is regularly the cheapest. On average its JL > QF => NH for ticket prices on SYD <> HND in Y. In J they have by far the cheapest tickets when on sale and they have sales like clockwork fo everything except peak travel periods.

NH has more capacity than JL. By at least 10-15% seats per 787. Iirc JL has a premium dense 787 configuration (until they swapped the 777 in) while NH has their regular configuration, so they have a few more rows of 3-3-3 Y than JLs 2-4-2 Y.

 

[eastwest101]

Don't speak to soon. They have contacted me again and said...they have made a mistake. Watch this space.

Yes they have made a mistake, if they reneg on their already offered and ticketed reroute from PER to SYD on VA and then SYD-HND on NH (return) you will have fun putting them through a consumer law misleading and deceptive conduct proceedings, which you will win as a slam dunk. Hang onto your ticket info and diarize your conversations and emails with VA customer service now.

Sounds like you cannot move your dates, so consider maybe a backup fully refundable fare from PER to HND with an alternative carrier maybe in case VA are stupid enough to drag this out over months?

 

[HS-TQE]

Keep in mind that the load factors don't account for (and can be very different to) yields.

While ANA's load factors are a bit less than the other airlines, they may be charging the highest fares and making good money overall. The passenger load factors also don't account for cargo, which can pay well.

As another poster pointed out, NH's fares are regularly the cheapest out of the 3 (with the exception of the school holiday/peak travel weeks), and the (assumed) low yielding customers from VA codeshares probably doesn't help their outbound (ex-Australia) yields.

Perhaps the freight on both services out of SYD is basically subsidising NH's low load factors?

 

[Sprucegoose]

It was the wrong product for connecting Australia to Tokyo. Having all of the eastern cities fly to CNS and then transfer to a 737 to fly to Tokyo doesn't make sense for any business class travel. And then when competing against Jetstar for the leisure market I think people still rather fly direct from the eastern cities in Australia.
I personally will not miss this route despite wanting a full service carrier to fly into HND.

I believe there was a broader business imperative, such as preserving the route given its potential value as part of an IPO valuation. Don't forget PE runs the business—they will have an exit strategy.

 

[QF WP]

Well I got lucky with this change - our trip to Japan for a family ski looks like it’s almost unchanged (had 2 minor time changes).








Now seriously looking at throwing some points at upgrades - at very least BNE/CNS and return. Got to look at the 4 x adult upgrades CNS/HND return, might not have enough points

 

[Mattg]

So from September until the end of services in February next year, VA will only run this route 4-6 times per week.

Genuine question: if they aren't running the route daily, does this risk jeopardising the future of the slot? It's not VA's problem at this point, but that daytime Haneda slot is allocated specifically for Australian airlines on a "use it or lose it" basis.

 

[Himeno]

So from September until the end of services in February next year, VA will only run this route 4-6 times per week.

Genuine question: if they aren't running the route daily, does this risk jeopardising the future of the slot? It's not VA's problem at this point, but that daytime Haneda slot is allocated specifically for Australian airlines on a "use it or lose it" basis.

The slot is allocated to the AU gov to assign to AU airlines.
If VA doesn't use it, it goes back to IASC to be reassigned.
Japan won't take if off Australia because the other half of the slot allocation is being used. To take the slot off AU, either JL or NH would have to lose their day slot.