Tokyo Haneda slot - how will Virgin Operate it?

[MEL_Traveller]

Don’t forget this one route cost Virgin a single MAX. They could get two Bali returns for the same aircraft.

At those loads mentioned above, plus the taxes/fuel costs for such a flight, seems like it was a nice money burner!

maybe they could apply for a JV with Rex in that route

 

[HS-TQE]

Don’t forget this one route cost Virgin a single MAX. They could get two Bali returns for the same aircraft.

At those loads mentioned above, plus the taxes/fuel costs for such a flight, seems like it was a nice money burner!

Plus also one of Anna's legacies. Our (Queensland) taxes went towards subsidising this flight.

I'm sure if it was a similar route out of MEL under the Victorian aviation funding, they'd replace Anna with "Dan".

Post automatically merged: Jul 22, 2024

maybe they could apply for a JV with Rex in that route

Or rather we'd see REX apply for the slot with their older 737-800s out of DRW with a weight restricted DRW-HND service

 

[BNEFlyer]

QSuites to Japan

QR have some ex-VA aircraft that still have The Business.

 

[Quickstatus]

This is maybe why:


And this article from January 2024:




Which does not help this:

 

[simmomelb]

QR have some ex-VA aircraft that still have The Business.

Such as this one

https://www.airfleets.net/ficheapp/plane-b777-37940.htm

 

[justinbrett]

This is maybe why:

View attachment 398795
And this article from January 2024:

View attachment 398797


Which does not help this:

View attachment 398796

But that's also making the outbound market surge

 

[yachty]

This is maybe why

I feel like the 'weak inbound' reason for cancellation is just a red herring. There's no way it was planned to live or die on POS Japan where VA is basically unknown.

 

[simmomelb]

Perhaps QR had something to say after looking over the books.

 

[Himeno]

Japan had 3.14 million inbound visitors last month. The 3rd month this year which has beaten records.
The current yearly record is 31.9 million in 2019 (which included a spike near the end of the year due to the rugby world cup).
They've had 17.78 million in the first half of 2024.

Arrivals from China are down 25% vs 2019. Chinese visitors were 30% of the total in 2019.

 

[Must...Fly!]

I feel like the 'weak inbound' reason for cancellation is just a red herring. There's no way it was planned to live or die on POS Japan where VA is basically unknown.

It would be a red herring if ANA/JL/QF pulled out. But VA/JQ running in/out of CNS, inbound market is extremely important to the success of those services. Unfortunate that once again, I think VA has just found themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time.

FNQ-JP has always been relatively fickle. The only mob that seems to have made it work long term really is JQ.

 

[Quickstatus]

outbound market surge

Japan had 3.14 million inbound visitors last month

BITRE suggests VA2 is not capturing that market. They need to operate from major capital cities

 

[PERLHR]

When will VA actually inform customers of flight cancellations or changes? Still no e mail from them received with alternatives. Are they really that amateurish? All over the media, but no official notification! Pathetic.

 

[Steady]

When will VA actually inform customers of flight cancellations or changes? Still no e mail from them received with alternatives. Are they really that amateurish? All over the media, but no official notification! Pathetic.

I received an email yesterday

 

[eastwest101]

It would be a red herring if ANA/JL/QF pulled out. But VA/JQ running in/out of CNS, inbound market is extremely important to the success of those services. Unfortunate that once again, I think VA has just found themselves in the wrong place at the wrong time.

FNQ-JP has always been relatively fickle. The only mob that seems to have made it work long term really is JQ.

Agree - wrong place due to wrong aircraft, if they were able to fly direct from HND to even BNE SYD or MEL they would have been filling the planes full of Australians who have been flocking to Japan in record numbers, just like JQ QF NH and JL who have all been filling their planes with Australians going to Japan and back. Exchange rates making life tough for Japanese people who would be holidaying overseas and not surprised to hear that domestic holiday destinations such as Okinawa are booming with Japanese people on holiday at the moment, so definitely an exchange rate and tourism story happening here. Virgin made zero effort at marketing at the Japanese end point of sale, made almost no effort using their partner in Japan (ANA) and made no effort reopening the Cairns lounge or at least co-ordinating feed for anyone else in Australia to have sensible connections to other major Australian cities.

I live close to Cairns and every time I have looked at flying VA to Japan it has often been the highest cost option and is easily the worst product with rubbish connections anywhere outside of Cairns, so totally unappealing to me. When you are being beaten by Jetstar's ordinary B787 product on price and on product you are on a hiding to nothing. I hope the QLD government subsidies were worth it, because they have handed the Japan-Australian market to Qantas and Jetstar on a platter.

 

[Zinger]

When will VA actually inform customers of flight cancellations or changes? Still no e mail from them received with alternatives. Are they really that amateurish? All over the media, but no official notification! Pathetic.

I received an email yesterday informing me they canceled my flight and rebooked me on a flight leaving a day early from HND to CNS which doesn’t suit me at all.

They also sent me an email on Wednesday of last week informing me that same now cancelled flight I had booked would now arrive in CNS 15 minutes later than scheduled.

 

[simmomelb]

When will VA actually inform customers of flight cancellations or changes? Still no e mail from them received with alternatives. Are they really that amateurish? All over the media, but no official notification! Pathetic.

I got my email yesterday and then called and rescheduled it (brought it forward).

 

[HS-TQE]

Agree - wrong place due to wrong aircraft, if they were able to fly direct from HND to even BNE SYD or MEL they would have been filling the planes full of Australians who have been flocking to Japan in record numbers, just like JQ QF NH and JL who have all been filling their planes with Australians going to Japan and back.

NH's loads isnt much better than VA's as pointed out previously and as per BITRE. NH suffer the reverse problem in Australia with minimal brand recognition (with the exception of the Star Alliance loyalists) despite the small VA FF partnership from the capitals which at best is delivering minimal benefits for NH thus far (and probably filling up with the VA"s low yield crowd out of the capitals) which delivers very little if any benefit to NH's bottom line.

 

[justinbrett]

BITRE suggests VA2 is not capturing that market. They need to operate from major capital cities

Or at least price accordingly to make the CNS stop more popular.

Their pricing wasn't far off QF from capital cities.

 

[jase05]

I know it’s only a fortnight out so doesn’t suit all but good J award on NH in both directions and ex Australia there seems good availability on QF and JL including plenty of F awards

 

[eastwest101]

NH's loads isnt much better than VA's as pointed out previously and as per BITRE. NH suffer the reverse problem in Australia with minimal brand recognition (with the exception of the Star Alliance loyalists) despite the small VA FF partnership from the capitals which at best is delivering minimal benefits for NH thus far (and probably filling up with the VA"s low yield crowd out of the capitals) which delivers very little if any benefit to NH's bottom line.

Agree with all your good points there, although ANA continued flying between Australia and Japan even throughout Covid, so that seems to me that they have a solid commitment to the market for some reason and/or there must be some money in it, considering they are competing against JL JQ and QF in the direct AUS-JPN market. Their loads may be light, but maybe they can extract decent yields? and maybe freight comes into it? Their overall cost base in Japan would be now very competitive against Qantas and Jetstars cost base in Australia due to the posts above talking about exchange rates and static wages in Japan compared to the runaway inflation, wages growth and higher AUD.