US Dividend Miles - post your SUCCESSFUL award bookings here.

[jgm]

Firstly, sorry to keep asking; I am eager to learn if I am mistaken.

So a, say, MEL-SIN-FRA//CDG-LHR (destination)-SIN-MEL itinerary is not technically an open jaw? I thought this was the exact definition of open jaw (i.e. arriving at a port followed by departure from another port, at any stage of the itinerary)??

It IS an open jaw, and won't be allowed with LHR being the destination. If you dropped the CDG-LHR flight and made your own way from FRA to LHR, it would be legal, as the open jaw is at your destination. The legal exceptions are where terminals are co-located (e.g. HND & NRT in Tokyo), where you are flying into and out of different airports in the same city.

 

[hossein_au]

It IS an open jaw, and won't be allowed with LHR being the destination. If you dropped the CDG-LHR flight and made your own way from FRA to LHR, it would be legal, as the open jaw is at your destination. The legal exceptions are where terminals are co-located (e.g. HND & NRT in Tokyo), where you are flying into and out of different airports in the same city.

As soon as I got to the "...won't be allowed..." I knew you were talking about USDM rules. I am/was trying to separate definitions from USDM rules. I am hoping to form a clear definition of open jaw versus stopover first. Then we can talk about what type of which is allowed or otherwise under USDM. I guess I am being too pedantic here...

 

[burmans]

Firstly, sorry to keep asking; I am eager to learn if I am mistaken.

So a, say, MEL-SIN-FRA//CDG-LHR (destination)-SIN-MEL itinerary is not technically an open jaw? I thought this was the exact definition of open jaw (i.e. arriving at a port followed by departure from another port, at any stage of the itinerary)??

Is is technically an open jaw in that you are flying in and out of a different port yes, USDM however imposes extra restrictions on when open jaws can be utilised.

 

[hossein_au]

Is is technically an open jaw in that you are flying in and out of a different port yes, USDM however imposes extra restrictions on when open jaws can be utilised.

Thanks for the clarification. That accords with my understanding as well...

 

[casanovawa]

Ok, to get back to the actual purpose of the thread:

PER-DOH-MAD-PHL-MIA-SXM (stop-open jaw) IAH-DOH-KUL-PER in J for 115k miles and US$213 in taxes and booking fee....

QR-QR-US-US-AA (stop) QR-QR-MH

Originally I tried booking PER-DOH-FRA-MAD-MIA-SXM which I could have flown QRs new A350 to FRA and Lan's B788 to MAD but then it was an Iberia flight to MIA and after about and hour and half on the phone they weren't going to let me have as they tried to find a valid routing, then they eventually were going to give it to me but the IB flight's surcharges would have brought the $ cost of the award to over $600, so I asked them to look some more for an alternative and they found the US MAD-PHL flight...

 

[exceladdict]

Ok, to get back to the actual purpose of the thread:

PER-DOH-MAD-PHL-MIA-SXM (stop-open jaw) IAH-DOH-KUL-PER in J for 115k miles and US$213 in taxes and booking fee....

QR-QR-US-US-AA (stop) QR-QR-MH

Originally I tried booking PER-DOH-FRA-MAD-MIA-SXM which I could have flown QRs new A350 to FRA and Lan's B788 to MAD but then it was an Iberia flight to MIA and after about and hour and half on the phone they weren't going to let me have as they tried to find a valid routing, then they eventually were going to give it to me but the IB flight's surcharges would have brought the $ cost of the award to over $600, so I asked them to look some more for an alternative and they found the US MAD-PHL flight...

Wow, nice!

I'm surprised the agent didn't ask you to huaca as they tend to do to me at the 1hr mark these days...

 

[anat0l]

Ok, to get back to the actual purpose of the thread:

PER-DOH-MAD-PHL-MIA-SXM (stop-open jaw) IAH-DOH-KUL-PER in J for 115k miles and US$213 in taxes and booking fee....

QR-QR-US-US-AA (stop) QR-QR-MH

Originally I tried booking PER-DOH-FRA-MAD-MIA-SXM which I could have flown QRs new A350 to FRA and Lan's B788 to MAD but then it was an Iberia flight to MIA and after about and hour and half on the phone they weren't going to let me have as they tried to find a valid routing, then they eventually were going to give it to me but the IB flight's surcharges would have brought the $ cost of the award to over $600, so I asked them to look some more for an alternative and they found the US MAD-PHL flight...

Nicely done.

I wouldn't go mad about the MAD/PHL flight (pun intended), unless US are putting on a A330 for that sector, but then again I wouldn't have been writing home about IB's service either, plus a $400+ differential probably doesn't justify the novelty of the 788 for a short sector as such.

 

[casanovawa]

It is an A333 with US, but when I look on seatguru it looks like a CX like herringbone 1-2-1 arrangement which doesn't look too bad???

The flight I was more looking forward to was the new A350, but hopefully QR will soon put that on flights direct DOH-PER vv so can have a ride then... And so no, didn't think it was quite worth extra $400...

 

[anat0l]

It is an A333 with US, but when I look on seatguru it looks like a CX like herringbone 1-2-1 arrangement which doesn't look too bad???

That is correct. In fact, US were the pioneers of the reverse herringbone configuration.

 

[Limewood]

Had a USDM booking to Europe return in J for two, problem was only flights out of HKG were via NRT had to say 2 nights and go on JAL 787 with not so good J seats reviews to CDG, looked and looked over few weeks to change HKG direct CDG (our stopover point), made a few calls all to no avail. Eventually (or lucky) last Thursday found a flight a day earlier, CX direct to CDG on BA and Award Nexus, called up and bingo had it changed, so saved 3 days in all, OK cost USD$150 each but we feel it was well worth it getting 3 extra days on the ground in Europe. So the motto of this is don't give up, try and try again if need be.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Had a USDM booking to Europe return in J for two, problem was only flights out of HKG were via NRT had to say 2 nights and go on JAL 787 with not so good J seats reviews to CDG, looked and looked over few weeks to change HKG direct CDG (our stopover point), made a few calls all to no avail. Eventually (or lucky) last Thursday found a flight a day earlier, CX direct to CDG on BA and Award Nexus, called up and bingo had it changed, so saved 3 days in all, OK cost USD$150 each but we feel it was well worth it getting 3 extra days on the ground in Europe. So the motto of this is don't give up, try and try again if need be.

Not to mention a much better product on CX vs JL! I understand JL are in the process of reconfiguring their 787s (at least the ones for ultra long haul) to the new business suite. That will make them more appealing.

Not sure what the date for completion is supposed to be.

 

[whole-lotta-moxie]

Just wondering, do all flights in & out of lhr get charged the luxury tax even if transiting through? I was quoted by us as the fee to be around $280USD even if not stopping in LHR.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Just wondering, do all flights in & out of lhr get charged the luxury tax even if transiting through? I was quoted by us as the fee to be around $280USD even if not stopping in LHR.

if you are flying on a single ticket, or conjunction tickets (specifically defined), and your stop is less than 24 hours, you don't need to pay the APD. Separate tickets will attract APD.

I believe you are still up for the security tax, which is quite hefty in itself.

if you have been overcharged for taxes, USDM is pretty good at refunding those. You can cross reference the taxes on ITA.

 

[whole-lotta-moxie]

if you are flying on a single ticket, or conjunction tickets (specifically defined), and your stop is less than 24 hours, you don't need to pay the APD. Separate tickets will attract APD.

I believe you are still up for the security tax, which is quite hefty in itself.

if you have been overcharged for taxes, USDM is pretty good at refunding those. You can cross reference the taxes on ITA.

thanks MEL_Traveller. Just to confirm that the APD and the luxury tax are one and the same. (Which is what I thought when I called up)

Yes I was just transiting thru from cdg via Lhr on the way to mxp and would have been a stop of only a few hours.
It was the rates desk that said I had to pay the luxury tax fee. I spoke to the rates desk and said that as I was transiting and not staying in London and I didn't have to pay the fee. She said there was no way around it and every one on first or bus class paid this fee.

It was going to cost around $500 usd pp, with the change fees and all the other fees I didn't end up changing my tix.

I have now had a look at those flights and they are gone. Not happy.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

thanks MEL_Traveller. Just to confirm that the APD and the luxury tax are one and the same. (Which is what I thought when I called up)

Yes I was just transiting thru from cdg via Lhr on the way to mxp and would have been a stop of only a few hours.
It was the rates desk that said I had to pay the luxury tax fee. I spoke to the rates desk and said that as I was transiting and not staying in London and I didn't have to pay the fee. She said there was no way around it and every one on first or bus class paid this fee.

It was going to cost around $500 usd pp, with the change fees and all the other fees I didn't end up changing my tix.

I have now had a look at those flights and they are gone. Not happy.

The other option would have been to have ticketed first, sought the refund later. I have had a similar issue resolved (and fairly quickly once they got the evidence they needed).

For a short haul flight to MXP ADP shouldn't have been that much anyway - unless you were flying long haul after that?

 

[whole-lotta-moxie]

The other option would have been to have ticketed first, sought the refund later. I have had a similar issue resolved (and fairly quickly once they got the evidence they needed).

For a short haul flight to MXP ADP shouldn't have been that much anyway - unless you were flying long haul after that?

Yes I was the flying long haul flights after that but a majority of the fees related to the Lhr stop to get to mxp to get the long haul flights. The rest of the charges were reasonable and I was happy to pay them and the $150 change fee.

 

[bcworld]

thanks MEL_Traveller. Just to confirm that the APD and the luxury tax are one and the same.

The use of the term 'luxury tax' is probably confusing and I would not expect any airline res agent to use it, because there is no such thing. Dropping it into a conversation with US agents probably gives them carte blanche to come up with a reason why your quoted taxes are high even if they are incorrect!

Ex UK there are general passenger movement charges plus the Air Passenger Duty (APD)...there is no 'luxury tax'.

The full rate for APD is levied on all classes except economy, and the rate for economy is reduced by 50%.

 

[whole-lotta-moxie]

The use of the term 'luxury tax' is probably confusing and I would not expect any airline res agent to use it, because there is no such thing. Dropping it into a conversation with US agents probably gives them carte blanche to come up with a reason why your quoted taxes are high even if they are incorrect!

Ex UK there are general passenger movement charges plus the Air Passenger Duty (APD)...there is no 'luxury tax'.

The full rate for APD is levied on all classes except economy, and the rate for economy is reduced by 50%.

Thanks bcworld. This is exactly what I expected. This was my second call got the same answer both times but I should have HUCA and tried for a third time.

 

[whole-lotta-moxie]

Update on the BA surcharges and the APD taxes. The flights that I originally wanted came back and so I called to enquire again about changing my flights

BEWARE: The agent lost my original seats when I enquired about the new seats. When I told her don't worry about it as she was wrong about the fees and charges she informed me that my seats on the original ticket were gone. She said that this was standard and to look up new seats she had to release the current seats.

It took 4 hours on Skype to resolve this problem with speaking to supervior!!!!

There were so many reasons that she gave me why the tickets or routes were invalid and they were all incorrect. Thanks to all my friends here I realised that almost every 'rule' or 'computer says no' I knew was incorrect.

After arguing with the superviour for about 20mins that the route and fee class was not invalid and that she had to give me those seats as her worker had made a mistake, she finally came back after checking with rates desk. This change would cost $88. Just before she was about to ticket it, I confirmed that this was for myself and my partner. No, it was just for me as my partner's flights were not lost. These were COMPLETELY different tickets on different dates and different routes. She wasn't going to volunteer this information. She refused to give my partner the same seats. She said it was because they were different fare classes. Which is incorrect.

She refused to ticket these flights for my partner even though the seats were avaliable. She admitted that the original agent made a mistake but she would not budge. After arguing for the longest time she finally said that she would do the booking. She went back to the rates desk. When she came back the fees and charges jumped to $700 USD. She said they made a mistake on the original quote and now it would be $700. This was for charges to transit in and out of LHR. She didn't even want to tell me what the breakdown of the charges were. She expected me to pay the $1,400 (for 2) without an explanation as to what they were for. I would not give up until she gave me a breakdown. This was almost double from what I was quoted a couple of days earlier. The charges were 'luxury tax ' again and other charges that I haven't ever head of. Thanks to my friends here I realised that these charges were incorrect. This was about 2 hours in to the conversation and I was over it.

While she put me on hold for the 100th time, I started trying to find alternatives. I luckily found a few different options. We started looking them up and we found a valid route. By the time that she went back to the rates desk again and came back to me the seats were gone.

I then found another way home. She did not volunteer any seats or routes. She was pretty useless. In between this she kept telling me that these routes, or fare classes etc were invalid. I knew that they weren't because I have read all the posts here. So every time she said no I had to challenge her and then she would go off and check, then 20 mins or so would come back and say ok.

So finally we found a route, she got my credit card details, it was an extra $35USD, no change fee charged. Then the call dropped out which was at 3 hours 45mins mark. I called them back and luckily they were able to put me back on to the original agent and she finally ticketed the flight. This was at about the 4 hour mark.

I have since checked the ticket, called Qatar and Cathay and they can see my flights and I have an e-ticket issued.

So beware when simply checking for a different route that you do not lose the original seats.

 

[casanovawa]

Yes, US Air can be a total pain in the @ss to deal with sometimes, I have had 3 hour calls and then friggin skype dropping out at crucial times and having to start all over, lucky you can get some great deals with them to partially make it worth it...

But most posts these days on here seem to have nothing to do with successful bookings and are probably better over on the other USDM threads...