Virgin Flyer 2-For-1

[bcworld]

Irrelevant, they are legally bound to the published T+C's - Pretty much anything but a 'sale fare' should be included, this includes business saver etc.

That's what I was trying to say...and that is Virgin Money's recently stated position. If you want to be bound by the August 2011 T&Cs then Saver Lite is NOT included in this offer.

 

[smit0847]

Im more arguing that from a customer service perspective, people arent going to bother keeping these cards and paying the interest/annual fees if the sole benefit of the card is really confusing and everytime they try and use it they're told it will cost them the same as buying a 2 x sale fares (like I was told yesterday).

It's an awful card in terms of website and phone support anyway. There's no point having this 2-4-1 offer if no-one wants to utilise it because it's either too confusing or of no value!

 

[Deleted member 29185]

everytime they try and use it they're told it will cost them the same as buying a 2 x sale fares (like I was told yesterday).

Same here today but not sale fares (saver lite is not a sale fare is it?).

CBR-OOL fare on VA site $99 x 2 = $198
CBR-OOL 241 via Velocity $198

Why have a 241 if it's the same as simply buying 2 x saver lites (luggage not withstanding)? The VFF lady thought saver lites were OK and I have bought 241 on a saver lite fare previously (only a week ago in fact), but the booking engine kept bringing up error. She finally worked out it was because of the saver lite fare she was trying to use and then only fare possible came out to exactly double the saver lite?

 

[Deleted member 29185]

you can get different stories from different call-center people who are reading different rules off their screens.

According to my latest attempt, it's worse than that. The lady did think saver lite were OK but the computer said NO.........

 

[bcworld]

According to my latest attempt, it's worse than that. The lady did think saver lite were OK but the computer said NO.........

If the only fare class loaded in Saver Lite was a sale fare then that would be the case.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

If the only fare class loaded in Saver Lite was a sale fare then that would be the case.

How do we know? They use to show up in red IIRC. This one is not in red but is the sale price of $99. Regardless, the "normal" fare CBR-OOL is $139 which still does not make a 241 = $198.

 

[bcworld]

How do we know?

We don't. That's the problem. They are no longer indicated on the fare matrix. Agreed though, it does look they are excluding all Saver Lite fares (depending on who you speak to).

 

[medhead]

How do we know? They use to show up in red IIRC. This one is not in red but is the sale price of $99. Regardless, the "normal" fare CBR-OOL is $139 which still does not make a 241 = $198.

But that could be explained by a bit of dumb computer logic. 2x saver lite = not eligible. Therefore, 2x$99 without thinking to kick up to the next eligible fare level.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

But that could be explained by a bit of dumb computer logic. 2x saver lite = not eligible. Therefore, 2x$99 without thinking to kick up to the next eligible fare level.

That sounds plausible. Either that or they're still adding in the taxes and surcharges with coincidentally equal 2 x sale fares.

Thing is, I didn't look it as a sale fare. I just looked on the date I wanted and saw the one and only CBR-OOL direct was $99. I did't want a connection as it would have been 2 x 241s used and I didn't check the sale pages. What a shemozzle! So before you ring VFF and spend 4 hours on the phone (as I did), check the sale pages first and take a guess accurate to 2 decimal places before applying the logical step of giving the Virgin money card the flick and save your money to buy sale fares straight off the web!

 

[smit0847]

Tried 3 times to book a 2-4-1 flight this morning. A simple MEL-SYD. For the same flight I was quote 3 different prices on the 3 different calls - first one quoted $180, second quoted $280, third quoted $130.

PS have VA moved their normal SG call centre to NZ? All 3 had kiwi accents.

 

[smit0847]

Tried to make a MEL-SYD booking 6 months out. Was told the price was exactly twice the current sale price for the same dates (so 1 2-4-1 is the same as 2 x sale). Asked why anyone would bother wasting 15 minutes on the phone using this offer when they can book a sale fare for the same price online. The guy had no idea. I wish Virgin Flyer would give some clarity around what the offer is or else people will just ditch the cards and book sale fares if they're the same price.

This is becoming like USDM - everytime I call up I get a different response.

An interesting quirk to this story - I didnt end up booking this flight for the reasons above but its now listed in My Bookings with a res number, seat selection and everything!! My CC has not been charged and the payments section on the My Booking summary is completely blank - should I assume this is just a phantom and I don't have a confirmed booking?!

 

[Deleted member 29185]

{Sale fares} use to show up in red IIRC. This one is not in red but is the sale price of $99. Regardless, the "normal" fare CBR-OOL is $139 which still does not make a 241 = $198.

But that could be explained by a bit of dumb computer logic. 2x saver lite = not eligible. Therefore, 2x$99 without thinking to kick up to the next eligible fare level.

Well, medheads idea has been proven for me today.

Following on from my CBR-OOL (attempted) 241 booking yesterday, I tried again today as the sale which was on, ran out last night, so saver lite fares back to the standard $135. Great, theoretically I can now book saver lite 241 for $135......wrong.

After usual extended period on hold, put through to BNE first time (on a winner here). The lady went through the whole process, only to come up with a saver lite deal of $231 :shock:. When queried she checked the saver fare which was actually cheaper, due what medhead suggested, the computer rejecting the saver lite and just doubling the saver lite normal fare (minus the 1/2 taxes which the VFF lady had already done). This worked out exactly as double the saver lite fare rather than using the saver fare. TWO 4 ONE.....I DON'T THINK SO and this in itself is fraud in my estimation. They're quite happy to use a 241 allocation, but sell you a standard fare! Uninitiated, beware! The first lady escalated my ensuing enquiry to a supervisor.

So I pointed out to the supervisor the T&Cs state 241 on SAVER, flexi and business and the only fare specifically ruled out being sale fares, she said VFF/VA/VM collectively decided saver lites are sale fares! No they aren't, I countered. Yesterday, that particular saver lite was a sale fare (was on sale for $99), but sale ran out last night and it's back to $135. Stock standard fare.....no sale, just a saver lite which IS a saver fare just without luggage. The supervisor attempted to escalate my argument further but no one would answer the phone (how unusual) so she decided to make an executive decision, (which she said she personally agreed with), to allow my 241 on the saver lite price. Funny enough, I was told very clearly the computer wouldn't allow that and they had tried it, but now all of a sudden it's possible!

OK so the new offer is presented. $150.96. I said why not $135 as advertised on the web site? She replied that web site price doesn't include taxes. Yes it does, the breakdown of fare/taxes is shown to the right of screen and the $135 is the total of fare and taxes. Nonetheless, the fare of $150.96 remains (from whatever means used to calculate it, which I cannot fathom). I said I'd accept it as my time (1Hr 3min at that point) was worth more than $15.96.

So my conclusions:
a) If not now, but the near future, saver lite fares will not be processed as 241
b) If not now, but the near future, taxes will be applied to the second supposedly free fare
c) Ensure you know the fares before you ring them (including the breakdown of fare and tax components)
d) These 241 flights will only be useful for buying flexis to upgrade to business or for buying business outright but that will depend upon the tax component.

We have between us, 2 x 241s left and when they're gone, we'll seriously consider scrapping these cards (wonder if VM has factored that in).

PS, I was very polite but firm when speaking to the VFF ladies. They were both very polite but there was a very noticable air of distain for me. I really feel sorry for the VR/VA telephone staff. They don't make these stupid decisions. They aren't responsible for ensuring T&Cs are accurate. They aren't responsible for communicating these changed T&Cs to all card holders BEFORE an attempted use, but they are lumbered with the very frustrating task of dealing with people trying to make bookings which were allowed (I made a 241 booking correctly off a saver lite just over a week ago) and now aren't.......apparantly. I really hope VR/VA reward these front line staff members adequately and recognise they're asking them to perform miracles. I also really hope VR/VA reward us poor beggars who've lost countless hours trying to fathom their changes by trial and error. Imagine how the non-AFF public are fairing with no info from others to cross check!

 

[Jama]

The first time I am told I need to pay the taxes, if its still called a 241, I will be complaining to Fair Trading. As far as I can see it is false advertising, bait advertising at best. I think swanning_it's experience warrants a complaint as using different pricing to base the 241 offer on to regular non sale pricing visible online definitely isn't right.

 

[bcworld]

As far as I can see it is false advertising, bait advertising at best. I think swanning_it's experience warrants a complaint as using different pricing to base the 241 offer on to regular non sale pricing visible online definitely isn't right.

But do the T&Cs have that covered?

 

[Jama]

The very title 241 is misleading and is not indicative of the true conditions. They need to change it. Maybe "Buy 1 get a little bit off the 2nd, except when there is a sale and there is no advantage". Might be a bit long ? Its not really that catchy either.

 

[Jama]

But do the T&Cs have that covered?

If the non sale price is $135 (in swanning_it's case) then the 241 is supposed to be based on that price. They can't just pluck another figure out of the air, lets say $150, and we'll call that the non discounted price whenever a 241 is involved and $135 the rest of the time. That's plain wrong. Terms and conditions are not a license to do what you want.

 

[Deleted member 29185]

But do the T&Cs have that covered?

Uhmmm. That may be the case. we did always have to cover booking and service fees (except this lady specifically told me she was waiving the booking fee).

 

[Deleted member 29185]

Uhmmm. That may be the case. we did always have to cover booking and service fees (except this lady specifically told me she was waiving the booking fee).

And if that's the case, will there ever be any use for the card? 1 x inflated fare, 2 x taxes, 2 x booking and service fees = perhaps more than 2 x original web fare?????

 

[Lizzi]

Has anyone had luck booking codeshare flights with the two41? I tried to book domestic Virgin flights operated by another carrier yesterday and after over an hour of assorted trials, the (very apologetic) frontline call centre lady and the Priority person she had on the phone with her conceded defeat and told me that it must not be valid for codeshares, even though none of them and none of their supervisors could actually confirm that this was the reason for the code not going through.

 

[notzac]

...and told me that it must not be valid for codeshares, even though none of them and none of their supervisors could actually confirm that this was the reason for the code not going through.

What exactly was the codeshare flight? The T&Cs call out that it must be booked on "Virgin Australia Australian domestic flights sold in Saver, Flexi and Business fare classes" ... if it was a VA coded flight on XR (Skywest), then I think you've got reason to complain. If it was a codeshare flight on any other airline, then they wouldn't be allowable.