A tale of two children (in J)

[The man with no name]

I cannot think of an instance where a passenger - unless elderly or frail - needs to grab the back of the seat in front to get out to the aisle. Passengers can lean backwards and grab the back of their own seat for support, if required.

You clearly spend too much time at the front of the plane otherwise you'd easily come up with an instance. Imagine you are travelling a packed Y class seat. The person in front has their seat reclined right back so it's only 10 inches from your face and the passengers on either side of you, neither of whom you know, are fast asleep with their seats in the upright position. Who do you disturb ?

I can come up with more

 

[The man with no name]

Here's an example that annoys the hell out of me and is more childish than a child.

Women who uncontrollably giggle loudly with every word they say after one glass of sparkling. Have you encountered that behaviour? It may not bother some people but bothers the hell out of me. See it quite regularly in lounges. If these women behaved the same way in flight then I wouldn't be able to sleep.

But it's not all women who behave this way. Just like not all children misbehave. My daughter misbehaves like any child but we try to keep her under control. We're not the type with glass in hand ignoring the child. But we're not going to be able to stop her everytime.

Give me a plane load of uncontrollably giggly women before one screaming toddler.

 

[GoldCanyon340]

Please let me know the brand of the amazing headphones you're using that cancels the noise of a screeching baby nearby

It's the Bose Biggus Gin And Toniccus.

 

[straitman]

I cannot think of an instance where a passenger - unless elderly or frail - needs to grab the back of the seat in front to get out to the aisle. Passengers can lean backwards and grab the back of their own seat for support, if required.

I may qualify as old but certainly not frail and really think you are totally wrong with this. A lot will depend upon how much recline the seat in front has but also on the size and shape of the person getting up.

It's all about everyone showing a bit of consideration.

 

[Forg]

I cannot think of an instance where a passenger - unless elderly or frail - needs to grab the back of the seat in front to get out to the aisle. Passengers can lean backwards and grab the back of their own seat for support, if required.

Who’s grabbing hold of it? There’s barely a thigh’s thickness between the armrest and a redlined seat-back, getting out without touching the seat in front is nearly impossible; and when the person in front is so massively selfish enough to stop your ability to read or watch the IFE why would you care about being the expert limboist & not touching the backrest? In hindsight I kinda wish I’d grabbed it & given it a good hard shake; if I’m not allowed to entertain myself, why should the bint get to have her afternoon nap?

 

[JohnK]

Why is there an expectation that J cabins come with peace and quiet?

Apparently you pay more to travel premium cabins and that comes with a lot of conditions not imposed on anyone travelling economy.

 

[Forg]

^ No it’s just experience; because expensive, noisy is less common.
I can see how you get used to something & that’s the norm; you expect it.

 

[flybynight]

I’m tired of new age parents with an uncaring attitude towards other passengers and who are happy for their kids to “express” themselves! I don’t know why airlines aren’t charging full fare for every passenger - no matter what age (after all, most kids are fairly high maintenance). A full fare regime would certainly reduce the number of kids and therefore the incidence of noise. Its not ok for me to scream for hours duing a flight so why should it be ok for kids. And don’t come that cough about the fact they are just kids. Bad parenting results in bad kids and a bit of preflight preparation results in much more settled and quieter kids.
On one particularly bad flight where the parents didn’t seem to give a toss, after things quietened down after many hours I thought “screw you” and put my blind up for the balance of the flight - giving them a bit of payback with brilliant light glaring through to where they were sitting.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

You clearly spend too much time at the front of the plane otherwise you'd easily come up with an instance. Imagine you are travelling a packed Y class seat. The person in front has their seat reclined right back so it's only 10 inches from your face and the passengers on either side of you, neither of whom you know, are fast asleep with their seats in the upright position. Who do you disturb ?

I can come up with more

You either disturb those between you and the aisle, or you disturb no one, and wait This is why some people prefer aisle seats, for easy access to get out and walk about, and some - who don't want to be woken during a night flight - choose windows. If you choose an aisle in economy you know you're likely to have to get up to let people out.

There’s barely a thigh’s thickness between the armrest and a redlined seat-back, getting out without touching the seat in front is nearly impossible...

'nearly impossible' but not impossible. I accept some people may not realise and grab the seat in front without thinking. But the outcome is still the same,, jolting the person sitting there. If my 85 year old mother can stand up without knocking the seat in front I dare say the majority of AFFers could do the same?

 

[harvyk]

<snip>
On one particularly bad flight where the parents didn’t seem to give a toss, after things quietened down after many hours I thought “screw you” and put my blind up for the balance of the flight - giving them a bit of payback with brilliant light glaring through to where they were sitting.

So hang on a second, you, as an adult, who has felt aggrieved by some kids acting as kids sometimes do, decided to take "payback", after the situation was over?

Kids are sometimes difficult, and no matter how much love and attention is given they are still difficult. But in this instance it sounds like you made the conscious decision to be an absolute cough.

(Edit: that last word was supposed to have an "a" in it)

 

[JohnK]

Babies are small, you'd just need a soundproofed section of overhead-locker near the bassinet mount-points. Job done!

Cone of silence? It can be above the bassinet and come down over the bassinet.

 

[Forg]

I accept some people may not realise and grab the seat in front without thinking. But the outcome is still the same,, jolting the person sitting there. If my 85 year old mother can stand up without knocking the seat in front I dare say the majority of AFFers could do the same?

I don't accept that she can, to be honest. Unless she's like Reed Richards.
Or the aisle-side armrest folds down & she's happy to slide sideways off the seat onto the floor - I wasn't actually aware that was possible 'til someone suggested it on AFF.

 

[Pushka]

You either disturb those between you and the aisle, or you disturb no one, and wait This is why some people prefer aisle seats, for easy access to get out and walk about, and some - who don't want to be woken during a night flight - choose windows. If you choose an aisle in economy you know you're likely to have to get up to let people out.



'nearly impossible' but not impossible. I accept some people may not realise and grab the seat in front without thinking. But the outcome is still the same,, jolting the person sitting there. If my 85 year old mother can stand up without knocking the seat in front I dare say the majority of AFFers could do the same?

And in the dark and in need of going to the bathroom, I will do my best not to disturb anyone as I don’t like leaving my footprint on others but if I have to use the seat in front as I am stuck by their full seat recline and don’t want to hurt my back then that is exactly what I will do. My 83 year old mother could never have done anything else. She was also legally blind. I’d rather not have her tripping trying to do some kind of gymnastics simply in order to not touch the seat of the person whose reclined into the area she needs to move out. I am in full admiration of your 85 year old mother as this well shy of 85 years old could not do this.

 

[drron]

'nearly impossible' but not impossible. I accept some people may not realise and grab the seat in front without thinking. But the outcome is still the same,, jolting the person sitting there. If my 85 year old mother can stand up without knocking the seat in front I dare say the majority of AFFers could do the same?

Good on your 85 year old mother.But there are many people who do not look frail that still have mobility and/or balance issues.I for one fit that and I hold on to the seat in front.Fortunately only fly Y domestically and can't remember a time where I had to get out of my seat.Not a problem in the international premium cabins we fly.
And maybe your mother needs to think about what may happen when she is standing without holding on and the plane hits turbulence.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Good on your 85 year old mother.But there are many people who do not look frail that still have mobility and/or balance issues.I for one fit that and I hold on to the seat in front.Fortunately only fly Y domestically and can't remember a time where I had to get out of my seat.Not a problem in the international premium cabins we fly.
And maybe your mother needs to think about what may happen when she is standing without holding on and the plane hits turbulence.

She stands up, puts her arm on her own seat back, and shuffles out.

I dunno. It sort of feels the examples of 'accepted behaviour' on this thread and the 'worse than feet on bulkhead' thread are often hard to reconcile. If an AFFer does something which inconveniences other passengers it is always justified. But if another passenger does something an AFFer doesn't like, there's no compromise. The other passenger is entitled, rude, ignorant or, 'a bogan'.

The difference in standards is confusing?

 

[Forg]

She stands up, puts her arm on her own seat back, and shuffles out.

I don't understand how this can physically work. In order to actually stand, your centre of gravity has to be over your feet; but that's not possible because your feet are in the gap between your seat-cushion & the seat in front, and the reclined Y seat-back is over the top of that gap.

I dunno. It sort of feels the examples of 'accepted behaviour' on this thread and the 'worse than feet on bulkhead' thread are often hard to reconcile. If an AFFer does something which inconveniences other passengers it is always justified. But if another passenger does something an AFFer doesn't like, there's no compromise. The other passenger is entitled, rude, ignorant or, 'a bogan'.

I wouldn't recline on someone else in Y. It's not the height of rudeness (I can think of ruder things to do to them ), but it's pretty rude.​

 

[Pushka]

I don't understand how this can physically work. In order to actually stand, your centre of gravity has to be over your feet; but that's not possible because your feet are in the gap between your seat-cushion & the seat in front, and the reclined Y seat-back is over the top of that gap.

I wouldn't recline on someone else in Y. It's not the height of rudeness (I can think of ruder things to do to them ), but it's pretty rude.​

Depends on the length of the flight and also if you’ve just come off a long international flight. And if you feel unwell. It happens.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

I don't understand how this can physically work. In order to actually stand, your centre of gravity has to be over your feet; but that's not possible because your feet are in the gap between your seat-cushion & the seat in front, and the reclined Y seat-back is over the top of that gap.

one armrest - if needed - is used to support and lift yourself up out of the seat. The other other arm supports/steadies you - if needed - by placing it on the back of your own seat. (It's the same on buses here in Melbourne - there's no recline but the design of the seats means you also have to grab the back of your own seat to slide in and out. Try grabbing the seat in front and there's going to be all sorts of troube!)

 

[Forg]

^ So you can't get out of a bus window seat unless the aisle seat person gets up? That's terrible design; I'll stick to trams.
At least the Skybus isn't like that!

But I digress; it's not about grabbing the seat in front, it's about not being able to avoid touching it while getting out. In order to lift your weight using your arms (your legs can't do anything due to centre-of-gravity problems previously mentioned) & then lift yourself sideways over the armrest in a yoga pose, it's very difficult to avoid touching that seat in front. Especially given that you can't have your backside in the seat without your knees pushing against the seat in front … you can't release that pressure while trying to perform the yoga, without the seat in front moving.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Touching a seat without causing any impact on the passenger in front is fine. But knocking the seat so the person in front can feel it seems unnecessary... unless you have a particular medical condition or disability.