Abbott in Government

[drron]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

I've criticised who exactly. I've simply said that the liberals have many capable women in parliament, contrary to the claims of the Abbott admirers that the those women were excluded from the ministry based on merit, presumably their lack of merit. Those names that I have mentioned are well known and have a long history including in Howard's government.

I am just as qualified to comment on the situation as you are on ALP PMs.

I posted a comment about Abbott in government and his ministry. It was simply an outline of my opinion about the situation. In response we had your post about experts (posting on AFF) on the parliamentarian liberal party. We had a post about men maintaining the rage on behalf of women, that failed to address the topic at all. We've had a couple of posts on my holding an opinion completely devoid of any attempt to address the points I raised.

Well here are a few of your opinions on people not yet sworn in to the ministry-
-
Then for experience there is an equally experience and competent women as Alan Tudge and Josh Frydenberg. Even Tessa Gambaro is missing.
-if she is unfit to do her job 100% effectively it is little more than pointless cost cutting for political gain. She needs to move past cheap political point scoring and realise that she now has a job to do for all Australians.
-Michael Kroger waxing lyrical on qanda about how the economy can't stand for them to reduce the debt any quicker that the old government planned to do. WTF? After 3 years of Abbott demanding that the ALP do exactly that? What a mob of hypocritical liars!
-I did give them a chance. Last night, 2 nights after the election, Michael Kroger and George Brandis applied different standards now they're in government. Basically they told us they've been lying for the last 3 years. I didn't have to wait long did I? Even I expected it would take them longer to do this sort of thing.
-Perhaps only tangentially related to Abbott in government. Have people seen that Peta Credlin one of his staff faced court on drink driving charges. But how is it possible for someone to blow 0.075, over the alcohol driving limit, and then have the charges dismissed by the magistrate? The news story is talk about no conviction, but I assume dismissing charges means no case to answer at all.
-He also leaned on the minor parties about his so called mandate. Unfortunately, that sort of bullying ignores the fact that Abbott blocked the ALPs mandate in the senate for 5 years. The evidence for the backflip is that Abbott is now demanding the alp support his policies. As many have told me in the election thread, it is not up to the opposition to vote in government policy.


So these are the negative things you have said about TA and liberals in this thread.
Now the challenge-find where I have said such things about the ALP shadow front benchers or leadership contenders in this thread.

Now my comment on experts on liberal experts here was quite obviously tongue in cheek but just for your benefit I should always add for your benefit.

And of course you keep bringing up old chestnuts such as-" Massive revenue contractions make it difficult to hit targets."
So again from Wayne's Budget papers-
2013‑14 Commonwealth Budget - Overview

So can you show me where there were massive revenue contractions?

-

 

[Pushka]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

I like some of the comments to that Abbott article. Like, why most Labor advertisements featured women, in the kitchen! And my, how many angry women did Labor use in their ads. The male actors seemed quite pleasant but they were usually tagged with an angry sounding partner.

 

[QF WP]

Thank God I am keeping my thoughts to myself than posting them in this thread :shock:

It is making for some interesting reading though...and a lot of Moderators time in reducing the comments to those appropriate for general reading ...

 

[drron]

And Clive's lead down to 64-
House of Representatives Division First Preferences

 

[QF WP]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

With 2,499 postal and pre-polling votes still to be counted:

http://vtr.aec.gov.au/HouseDecScrutinyProgressByDivision-17496-NAT.htm

I notice 1 polling station hasn't be counted...

 

[amaroo]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

As a Fairfax voter......c'mon Ted!

 

[drron]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

With 2,499 postal and pre-polling votes still to be counted:

Declaration Vote Scrutiny Progress

I notice 1 polling station hasn't be counted...

And the Libs have been winning the postal votes 65% to 35%.

 

[medhead]

Seems it's been a little bit longer than Barry Jones since we've not had a science minister*. Somewhere between 50 and 82 years.

Liberal MP Dennis Jensen hits out at Coalition for dumping science portfolio

* I guess this illuminates the level of expertise around here on ALP parliamentarians.



Interesting list. Shame you didn't bother to read it.

Well here are a few of your opinions on people not yet sworn in to the ministry-
-
Then for experience there is an equally experience and competent women as Alan Tudge and Josh Frydenberg.

I said There are competent and experienced women in the liberal. That is not negative

Even Tessa Gambaro is missing.

Fact

-if she is unfit to do her job 100% effectively it is little more than pointless cost cutting for political gain. She needs to move past cheap political point scoring and realise that she now has a job to do for all Australians.

Fact. Making yourself outfit to do your job at 100% efficiency is pointless.

-Michael Kroger waxing lyrical on qanda about how the economy can't stand for them to reduce the debt any quicker that the old government planned to do. WTF? After 3 years of Abbott demanding that the ALP do exactly that? What a mob of hypocritical liars!

Michael Kroger is well known. Michael Kroger said exactly that, and even admitted that he was applying a different standard = fact.

-I did give them a chance. Last night, 2 nights after the election, Michael Kroger and George Brandis applied different standards now they're in government. Basically they told us they've been lying for the last 3 years. I didn't have to wait long did I? Even I expected it would take them longer to do this sort of thing.

Again they are well known and have been ministers already. They said these things and admitted they were applying a different standard = Fact.

-Perhaps only tangentially related to Abbott in government. Have people seen that Peta Credlin one of his staff faced court on drink driving charges. But how is it possible for someone to blow 0.075, over the alcohol driving limit, and then have the charges dismissed by the magistrate? The news story is talk about no conviction, but I assume dismissing charges means no case to answer at all.

That's called a question about legal process in relation to one example. It is not negative.

-He also leaned on the minor parties about his so called mandate. Unfortunately, that sort of bullying ignores the fact that Abbott blocked the ALPs mandate in the senate for 5 years. The evidence for the backflip is that Abbott is now demanding the alp support his policies. As many have told me in the election thread, it is not up to the opposition to vote in government policy.

Again Abbott has already been a minister and is well known. He said refused to support the ALP's mandate and is now demanding people respect his mandate. This is a matter on the public record. It is a FACT.

Now the challenge-find where I have said such things about the ALP shadow front benchers or leadership contenders in this thread.

As for your comments you've already admitted that you've attacked the past two PMs.

I'm glad you are happy with Bronwyn Bishop, someone you accept as competent.

... you will find that I have NEVER said anyone was incompetent. Typical misrepresentation of my posts again.

 

[drron]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

My problem Medhead is that your personal attacks are not even snide.
I present my opinions.Because they do not align with yours does not make them personal attacks-snide or otherwise.

 

[medhead]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

I see my prediction, even before the ministry was sworn in, that Abbott would fix the Wallabies and the Cricket team was correct. Minister of Sport.

 

[Skyring]

Seems it's been a little bit longer than Barry Jones since we've not had a science minister*. Somewhere between 50 and 82 years.

That's as may be. Nevertheless, Bob Hawke abolished the Department of Science - my department - in 1987 and though he may have had the title, that's all it was. No department, no policy, no power. All the various bits were hived off to other departments, and the bulk of we staff were transferred to Department of Industry Technology and Commerce, where we languished until we found other things to do.

 

[amaroo]

That's as may be. Nevertheless, Bob Hawke abolished the Department of Science - my department - in 1987 and though he may have had the title, that's all it was. No department, no policy, no power. All the various bits were hived off to other departments, and the bulk of we staff were transferred to Department of Industry Technology and Commerce, where we languished until we found other things to do.

That's interesting........fools gold political shenanigans.

 

[moa999]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

-Perhaps only tangentially related to Abbott in government. Have people seen that Peta Credlin one of his staff faced court on drink driving charges. But how is it possible for someone to blow 0.075, over the alcohol driving limit, and then have the charges dismissed by the magistrate? The news story is talk about no conviction, but I assume dismissing charges means no case to answer at all.
-He also leaned on the minor parties about his so called mandate. Unfortunately, that sort of bullying ignores the fact that Abbott blocked the ALPs mandate in the senate for 5 years. The evidence for the backflip is that Abbott is now demanding the alp support his policies. As many have told me in the election thread, it is not up to the opposition to vote in government policy.

-

Pretty much all around Australia 0.05-0.79 is low range and for a first offence you get a s17 or equiv no convictions recorded and a fine... From what I have read that's what Credlin got after saying she made a mistake and in us terms pleading no contest -- remember a conviction sticks with you so there is a small tolerance. A bit higher and I suspect a different result.

While Abbot was publicly negative it was still something like 90℅ of all bills passed with Liberal support in Senate. Is also much harder to say Labor had a clear mandate given it was a minority government and the relative seat and 2pp vote split.

 

[medhead]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

Pretty much all around Australia 0.05-0.79 is low range and for a first offence you get a s17 or equiv no convictions recorded and a fine... From what I have read that's what Credlin got after saying she made a mistake and in us terms pleading no contest -- remember a conviction sticks with you so there is a small tolerance. A bit higher and I suspect a different result.

The question was about the difference between charges dismissed and no conviction. If people bother to not selectively focus on one post and read the other posts about this they might get some edification about the purpose of my question and the answer that was found with help from here. Seems it is much easier for them to selectively quote and claim something that doesn't exist in order to bully me.

I personal think all claims of a mandate are a load of cough. The alp never claimed a mandate 3 years ago. My comment is about abbott's behaviour for the last 3 years and his hypocrisy once the roles are reversed.

 

[medhead]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

As long as we are going the quote articles from the SMH maybe this one from Mark Kenny should be included.

Abbott is a new man, but the left can't see it


​

An article where words speak loudly than actions. I think it'd be more fair if you described it as an opinion piece rather than an article. Articles have connotations of no bias.

 

[amaroo]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

The alp never claimed a mandate 3 years ago..

How could they?

They didn't have one or need one. They just did what the Greens told them to do.......

 

[Hvr]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

How could they?

They didn't have one or need one. They just did what the Greens told them to do.......

Much like the Catholic church will tell Abbott how to run the government.

 

[Skyring]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

Right so Abbott stood up in front of a sign that effectively called the PM a B**** and let himself be filmed doing so.

There's no evidence he even knew the sign was there. There's one photo showing the sign in front of Abbott, and a clever camera angle to imply that it was behind the stage - and it would have had to have been about ten metres high.

But that's by the bye. It wasn't Abbott's sign, it wasn't his protest - the totality of the indignation is that "Abbott let himself be filmed". Big deal.

Now this doesn't make it the darkest day in Australian politics. Protests typically have strongly worded or outrageous signs and stunts. How many times have we seen politicians hung or burnt in effigy at rallies? An implicit death threat surely trumps even the most spirited name-calling.

As for name-calling, Pauline Hanson copped far worse than Julia Gillard ever did. From the ALP.

For the darkest deeds in politics, you'd have to be looking at acts that involved treachery, treason, or death. We've had political murders in Australia - how does that stack up against name-calling?

We've had wars, acts of terror, political coughry of all kinds, and yet some nonentity doing a bit of spirited name-calling is the darkest day in Australian politics. What a load of utter tripe!

Gough Whitlam would mention another day that he considered worse, I'm sure.

Medhead, you're a reasonable person. Why not cut the hyperbole? It adds heat rather than light here.

 

[Skyring]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

Much like the Catholic church will tell Abbott how to run the government.

We have evidence that Gillard accepted some of the Green demands. Tony Abbott isn't even Prime Minister yet and there's no evidence that he will do the bidding of any supposed religious masters.

However, on this point I'll keep an open mind. His prior behaviour on the RU486 thing is a worry. I doubt he was following any specific direction there, but his own beliefs would have directed his hand. As, I am sure, the PPL scheme is aimed at making it easier for people to follow Catholic directives.

 

[DC3]

Re: Oz Federal Election 2013 - Discussion and Comments

Humorous little article by Annabele Crab from Monday, titled "A ministry of merit conspicuously lacking in women".

"... Faced with the need to abandon the Lodge for serially-delayed repairs, he swiftly chose instead the monastic accommodation at the Australian Federal Police cadet headquarters.

And today, Mr Abbott has announced his new Cabinet: Nineteen blokes and a Bishop. Perfect ..."

Any yes, I can be easily amused.

A ministry of merit conspicuously lacking in women - The Drum (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)