Abbott in Government

[Pukka]

We don't pay bucket loads of tax. We have one of the lowest tax burdens in the OECD.

Indeed, the budget problem is almost entirely on the revenue side, in no small part thanks to Howard & Costello's using once-off windfalls to fund structural tax cuts and restructure the tax system to dramatically favour the wealthy and high earners.

Said tax revenue would certainly help a lot more if it wasn't being wasted on people earning six figure incomes, subsidising landlords, and being collected in a manner that encourages asset speculation and discourages productive enterprise.

I'm well aware that we all don't pay bucket loads of tax that's a special treat for the select few. I'm referring to your comments that Cove doesn't do anything to help.

I'm fairly certain he pays lots of tax & therefore is helping out more than most.

 

[Moody]

500 billion in debt.100 days in Government.So Tony and Joe are responsible for 5 billion excess expenditure per day.
You are right I don't swallow that sort of tripe.

I assume you and Pukka have been drinking ..... maybe you should re-read my post when you are sober. Then again - why break a habit?

Joe Hockey ASKED for an increase of $200B in the debt ceiling to take it to $500B (have you been living under a rock?). He was trying to get in early so that he could later say it was all Labour debt when the actual figure was sub $300B when the "Adults" (sic) came into power. Labour wasn't having a bar of it and quite generously allowed Joe another $100B, but in the end the Greens got fed up with the childish finger-pointing and removed the ceiling in return for a bit more fiscal honesty.

Probably save a repeat of the debt games as there is little doubt Australia will crash through $500B - the only question is who will be in charge when it does.

 

[Moody]

I'm well aware that we all don't pay bucket loads of tax that's a special treat for the select few. I'm referring to your comments that Cove doesn't do anything to help.

I'm fairly certain he pays lots of tax & therefore is helping out more than most.

But is he paying as mush tax as he should? That is the real question and for privacy reasons the answer is a matter between the ATO and cove.

 

[Pukka]

But is he paying as mush tax as he should? That is the real question and for privacy reasons the answer is a matter between the ATO and cove.

Well if he's like me he's paying too much I think we should spread the burden a bit more.

 

[alieninperth]

Enough of the attacks on cove. I've met the man and we talked at length about some of the things that he has done, and continues to do, for some of the most needy people in our society. I couldn't give a coughk if he doesn't pay as much as he should (by your measure), he pays what he has to and no more. Did you pay extra tax last year, or not take a deduction? He and others like him do more than their fair share both indirectly though payment of tax and directly.

Can you point to how many people you have helped to turn their lives around over the last few years? Cove can.

I don't post here often but I cannot stand by and watch unwarranted and ill founded attacks on someone when I know them to be false.

 

[james4321]

Well if he's like me he's paying too much I think we should spread the burden a bit more.

And therein lies the problem summed up beautifully .. everybody should pay more - that is except me of course !!!.

 

[alieninperth]

Well, I reckon that I pay about twice the average. Do I think thats a lot, yes. Do I think I should pay more, no. Do I think I should pay less, maybe. I pay a significant amount of money in taxes, and yet I still have to pay for healthcare, dental, potentially schooling for my kids. Where the hell does it all go, that's what I want to know. Social security and welfare I get, but what is other expenditure.

 

[11sjw]

Enough of the attacks on cove. I've met the man and we talked at length about some of the things that he has done, and continues to do, for some of the most needy people in our society. I couldn't give a coughk if he doesn't pay as much as he should (by your measure), he pays what he has to and no more. Did you pay extra tax last year, or not take a deduction? He and others like him do more than their fair share both indirectly though payment of tax and directly.

Can you point to how many people you have helped to turn their lives around over the last few years? Cove can.

I don't post here often but I cannot stand by and watch unwarranted and ill founded attacks on someone when I know them to be false.

Well said.

 

[Hvr]

So why are we paying hundred's of millions of dollars to Holden employees who have 3 years to reskill before retrenchment?

It is to the shame of both parties that they support this wanton waste of money. These costs should be borne by Holden (happily accepting corporate welfare) as the employer rather than directly by the taxpayers.

Given there will soon be no car manufacturers in Australia Rudd's proposal to stop middle class welfare in the form of car write offs seems prescient.

 

[wmetz]

The blame is clearly with Howie and the team he had including this current mob. Years of Australian growth, yet revenues were all spent or given back to high income earners. Assets sold at below market rates. Rebates for private health (so they could buy fancy sports wear), the un-means tested baby bonus etc. And when Julia tried to cut back on these social handouts for people in high income brackets, Mr Tony and friends blocked it every time.

The only time they didnt block or say anything, is when the govern started to cut off single mothers. Plenty rich single mothers! The last labour gov apart from a one off expense of the 1000 tax refund, which only went to people who earned atleast 10k the previous year. That was their only major spending. And I didnt see anyone hand their cheques backs. And you cant claim the NBN is a major expense, as very little project money as been spent and told expense is over 10 years. If you look deep into their spending, you will see they spent money in infrastructure and not just roads like tony will spend on. In Brissie, 1 new train line out to the suburbs (opened just this month) and in a year or 2 another out to the suburbs.



And before you complain about the carbon tax and mining tax, If we dont have these types of indirect tax methods then revenue will only get worst.
A GST increase impact on low income families. If this government tried to change the GST rate, the first thing they would do is cut the high income tax rate which further shifts the tax bill to lower incomes. The best thing about mining tax is, at the end of the day the overseas buyer is in-affect paying the tax.
The GST is only tax money paid by Australians, and since we dont export anything but coal or gas, anyone with half a brain would realize that the government will need to get these overseas users or buyers to put money in the treasury.

 

[drsmithy]

I'm well aware that we all don't pay bucket loads of tax that's a special treat for the select few.

No-one in Australia pays bucket loads of tax. We are a low-taxing nation.

I'm referring to your comments that Cove doesn't do anything to help.

What I actually said was he wouldn't do anything to help fix the problems.

I'm fairly certain he pays lots of tax & therefore is helping out more than most.

Not quite sure how that's relevant.

 

[drsmithy]

Well, I reckon that I pay about twice the average. Do I think thats a lot, yes. Do I think I should pay more, no. Do I think I should pay less, maybe. I pay a significant amount of money in taxes, and yet I still have to pay for healthcare, dental, potentially schooling for my kids. Where the hell does it all go, that's what I want to know. Social security and welfare I get, but what is other expenditure.

Budget 2013: where will your tax go? - Budget 2013 - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

In the context of the public services we have available, Australia has quite low taxes. Few other Governments deliver as much with as little.

Feel free to nominate a jurisdiction where you think you would pay less tax.

 

[cove]

Singapore and Hong Kong.

 

[drsmithy]

Singapore and Hong Kong.

Why haven't you relocated there ?

 

[cove]

You first!

 

[drsmithy]

You first!

Who first what ?

 

[alieninperth]

Well average weekly earnings is $1422, so they must pay the average amount of tax. You only earn $2844 a week. You poor sod! Even I earn more than that.

Not even close to that Medhead. I know, I'm a pauper earning more than the majority of people in the country!!

 

[Pukka]

No-one in Australia pays bucket loads of tax. We are a low-taxing nation.


What I actually said was he wouldn't do anything to help fix the problems.


Not quite sure how that's relevant.

It's relevant because the top 1% of earners pay around 17% of all tax and the top 10% pay around half.
So there are givers and takers.

 

[drsmithy]

It's relevant because the top 1% of earners pay around 17% of all tax and the top 10% pay around half.

The top 10% probably hold 90% of the wealth and earn 80% of the income. Only paying half the tax is a bargain.

Anyway, how is that relevant to the structural problems facing the economy ? Do you want to make an argument against progressive taxation as a principle ?

So there are givers and takers.

If the rich are so worried about how much tax they "give" the Government, they could instead pay their employees more. As a bonus, that would also mean those employees needed to "take" less from the Government.

 

[777]

It's relevant because the top 1% of earners pay around 17% of all tax and the top 10% pay around half.
So there are givers and takers.

A. Your maths is wrong.
B. Your thinking about society is worse than your maths.