Heads up about program changes

[SydneySwan]

You mean simple, surely?

Simple - another word redefined by the Qantas English Dictionary!

 

[RooFlyer]

We’ve got an amazing in-house IT team

- Qantas Loyalty’s Chief Marketing Officer Stephanie Tully , from the AusBT article linked above.

You know, I do parody. Sometimes I do self parody. Sometimes I do party jokes, irony, dry humour, self flagellation for a laugh, witty repartee, anything really.

The trick to a good joke I find is not to stretch credibility too far. There has to be some sort of possibility of the object of the joke to actually be true.


Unfortunately Ms Tully does not appear to have mastered this concept. If she was seeking advice, mine would be for her to get out of stand up comedy.

 

[SydneySwan]

- Qantas Loyalty’s Chief Marketing Officer Stephanie Tully , from the AusBT article linked above.

You know, I do parody. Sometimes I do self parody.

Ah it could be that the Qantas English Dictionary defines parody quite differently from its meaning in the AFF world!

 

[anat0l]

You've obviously given the issue a great deal of time, attention and follow-up - I for one am most grateful for that. A number of ex-cathedra statements, so I'm guessing you have certain definitive knowledge of what's going on within MMB, so again, that's useful here. There appears to be some sensitivity to the criticism however, which is a bit unfortunate. I apologise if I hit a raw nerve, but unfortunately from my point of view QF has brought much of the criticism upon itself, in the utterly ham fisted way it handles its web site and the enhancements a-plenty to its program. There have been a number of examples given in AFF recently about contradictory advice being given within the QF web site and/or by Qantas front-line staff, so a quote here and there isn't necessarily that illuminating. But happy days, certain folks know the answers; its just a matter of them devoting he time and effort to let us know the facts.

Just a reminder, if I may, without wishing to rankle further. Its not that uncommon here for a member to make an observation and/or ask a question, and for others to make comments and further observations. And sometimes either the initial comment or some follow up one(s) may be incorrect. Sad, I know, but true. Goodness knows I've posted a couple of howlers. But having done so, I know there is always some-one here who will come in and make it right, with maybe a bit of rhetorical flourish thrown in.

And we are all so much the better off for it.

The sensitivity to criticism is due to the fact that the initial critique is very much disproportionate to the actual manifestation of an issue, of which in my opinion there was very little. Again, it is like being arrested and charged just for the pure thought that you were there and no one likes you, not even with credible evidence nor initial questioning. I don't care if it is Qantas, Virgin, or God forbid, Ryanair. Certainly we don't seem to do this to our fellow human beings, unless we're in some sort of socialist dictatorship.

And yes I am looking at the "flights vs journeys" issue here in isolation, which was the only point raised by drron in his initial argument. I was not referring to the lack of trust or loss thereof which clearly has been expressed ad nauseum here and I have no counterargument for that (rational, emotional or desire to lodge one). I do feel taken aback as if my attempt to bring some roundedness to the sphere of argument here was very much unwelcome, tantamount to criminal. Ergo, I would be lying if I didn't confess that I feel bad for having even attempted to participate. I think that admission comes to some satisfaction to many of you.

I'm glad you are certain anat01 but the situation is new on the QF website.
It is not all same day flights.I have a 17 hour layover in DFW to get a good night's sleep yet all are grouped.

Which again, is not an entirely new concept, and not even on QF's website. But it has never affected how one has perceived what a flight is.

Throwing in the same calculation into the calculator with a slight date shift gives the same result.

The new SC table says nothing about separate flight numbers but does say things like Europe to Asia on partner airlines.

What befuddles me is the old table, AFAIK but happy to be corrected, didn't mention anything about separate flight numbers either. So if we had the old table but the new MMB, would you calculate your SCs by adding up all the constituent mileages together then looking up the table?

Again, whatever your confusion was didn't warrant a witch burning.

I wish I could be as certain as you but I distrust QFF.
Simple.So I will wait for a real example being posted before believing your version.
As for contacting QF-I did before our last trip.I was told our MH flight on 3/7 would earn at the old rate.It didn't.So can you see why I distrust QF?

I believe for the underlined word you meant to say naive; whether or not you were being diplomatic or didn't want to offend I'll leave that to you.

I will be clear now that I don't have any better knowledge of the answer to the issue more than most people here could find out themselves. I wrote my own QFF new system Points and SC calculator and shared it with a few people, quite a few weeks before the new QFF calculator was released of recent. I had to ask a few questions so I just contacted QF. The flights vs journeys issue didn't really come up but the distinction was made during some exchanges. Now I could be just as cynical and claim that the agents I talked to are wrong, but we'll find out I guess.

Not to mention that if we deferred to a journey system for a flight taken within the current T&C version, that would be a violation of the QFF T&Cs with no notice. I think that is veritable grounds for litigation or action via the airline advocacy. So far IIRC there has been no rug pulls on T&C revisions (that have had a widespread impact like we are discussing right now) and the definition of a Flight has not changed. Sure QFF might do one soon, or they may eventually decide to change to a journey based system, but we'll have to see.

As for your last conversation, I have no idea how it went, but I'm suspecting some misunderstanding, otherwise fair enough you have grounds for complaint (in fact, you may even have legal recourse). You obviously can't be distrusting QF that much since you're bold enough to still consider crediting to them, which I find odd. That's like staying in a physically abusive relationship and not reporting it to the police - "everything is fine....."

Loss of trust does not depend on the specific issue and whether we all question it. I wouldn't question this issue myself, but I isn't a sign that I trust Qantas. The lack of questioning about this issue does not address the point made that such questioning by experienced travellers shows a breakdown in trust. I completely agree there has been a breakdown in trust. I'm in an extremely difficult situation of having 10 Qantas gift vouchers expiring in December, about 15 more flights to book for 2014 but a fundamental unwillingness to support Qantas' actions by actually booking flights.

And my primary thrust in answering was about this flights vs journeys issue, which seemed to then blow out as a valid foundation for substantial criticism, when the initial foundation had very little basis. Especially when no attempt at resolution was made, apart from ranting here and hoping someone would answer.

I have no argument against the lack or loss of trust in Qantas; all I can say to all of you is that I hope you are making the correct decisions. Reading all of this rhetoric, I'm fundamentally doubting this is the case.

 

[medhead]

And my primary thrust in answering was about this flights vs journeys issue, which seemed to then blow out as a valid foundation for substantial criticism, when the initial foundation had very little basis. Especially when no attempt at resolution was made, apart from ranting here and hoping someone would answer.

I have no argument against the lack or loss of trust in Qantas; all I can say to all of you is that I hope you are making the correct decisions. Reading all of this rhetoric, I'm fundamentally doubting this is the case.

I was just responding to you reply to the comment about trust. I don't have a dog in this fight. I'm also firmly moving to the view that we don't really know what will happen until the system developed by the amazing IT team gives us an answer.

As for whether I'm doing the right thing. Unfortunately, I'm actually doing nothing, which is probably worse. I can't bring myself to book VA either, despite them being close to 30% cheaper.

 

[drron]

First anat01 I did mean certain where you underlined it.I was not critiscising you at all.I really hope you are right.
As I have said many times I am not crediting to QFF.However mrsdrron is with the aim of achieving LTG and hence LTQP.
I am a cynical person by nature and going back to the ABT article I wonder why the new points earning on partner airlines wont be out until the end of September.Maybe that will be 3 months after the earning method for QFF came out along with the SC earnings for partners which definitely is a zonal system and not mileage based as previously.Hence the 3 months notice has in effect been given.

 

[BD1959]

- Qantas Loyalty’s Chief Marketing Officer Stephanie Tully , from the AusBT article linked above.

You know, I do parody. Sometimes I do self parody. Sometimes I do party jokes, irony, dry humour, self flagellation for a laugh, witty repartee, anything really.

The trick to a good joke I find is not to stretch credibility too far. There has to be some sort of possibility of the object of the joke to actually be true.


Unfortunately Ms Tully does not appear to have mastered this concept. If she was seeking advice, mine would be for her to get out of stand up comedy.

Maybe Ms Tully is using the term "Qantas Loyalty" in a different manner to which you're assuming ... ??

Regards,

BD

 

[RooFlyer]

OK, here's one for the MMB and QFF experts.

I've just had an itinerary to Nth America ticketed. I went in to the booking and the first thing it asked me for were my contact details. Yes, I was logged on, the booking is associated with my QFF number and my contact details in my profile haven't changed. Yet it needed me to enter day phone, evening phone, mobile phone and e-mail. Those clever Qantas IT people at it again.

Ho-hum.

But this is where I need help with from the experts. My flights consist of QF operated/metal; Alaskan operated/QF code share and Alaskan operated and coded, all on one PNR. This is what comes up in MMB (one image; the lines are immediately next to one another).
View attachment 34249


So if something applies to "all flights in your trip" but also applies to "Qantas operated flights only", does it apply to he Alaskan operated and coded leg of the journey?

Over to the experts.

 

[defurax]

OK, here's one for the MMB and QFF experts.

I've just had an itinerary to Nth America ticketed. I went in to the booking and the first thing it asked me for were my contact details. Yes, I was logged on, the booking is associated with my QFF number and my contact details in my profile haven't changed. Yet it needed me to enter day phone, evening phone, mobile phone and e-mail. Those clever Qantas IT people at it again.

Ho-hum.

But this is where I need help with from the experts. My flights consist of QF operated/metal; Alaskan operated/QF code share and Alaskan operated and coded, all on one PNR. This is what comes up in MMB (one image; the lines are immediately next to one another).
View attachment 34249


So if something applies to "all flights in your trip" but also applies to "Qantas operated flights only", does it apply to he Alaskan operated and coded leg of the journey?

Over to the experts.

You should let your TA deal with that!
TA are lucky enough to be able to bypass the "amazing website" designed by the amazing in-house IT people

Who refers to their staff as being amazing anyway? I don't want an amazing QF calculator, I just want a working calculator.

 

[whatmeworry]

Don't know if this has been posted somewhere else, but according to this article in AusBT, QFF new point stucture on OW and partner airlines should be released end of September...Qantas to reveal frequent flyer points earn for partner airlines next month - Flights | hotels | frequent flyer | business class - Australian Business Traveller

I love the quote about: "forget the tables, use the calculator..."

And

“We’ve got an amazing in-house IT team" :shock:

QF points and SC's structure is now one of the most shambolic programs.

“We’ve got an amazing in-house IT team"

Does QF actually have an inhouse IT team or are they talking about the team they outsourced the IT too, which is made up of virtually 457 visa holders?

HAYDEN COOPER: At Qantas, TCS is known as a tier one partner. It's held a $120 million IT contract with the airline for the past seven years. But its Australian based staff working on the account are almost all brought from overseas. This is the list of TCS workers at Qantas. Of the 211 names almost 200 are on 457 visas, filling roles like business analysts, project managers, even accountants. This woman doesn't want to be identified because she's looking for work in the IT sector, but the former business analyst was employed by TCS, and says she witnessed an open reliance on 457 visas at the expense of local graduates.

Workers accuse IT giant of 457 abuse - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

 

[anat0l]

OK, here's one for the MMB and QFF experts.

I've just had an itinerary to Nth America ticketed. I went in to the booking and the first thing it asked me for were my contact details. Yes, I was logged on, the booking is associated with my QFF number and my contact details in my profile haven't changed. Yet it needed me to enter day phone, evening phone, mobile phone and e-mail. Those clever Qantas IT people at it again.

Ho-hum.

But this is where I need help with from the experts. My flights consist of QF operated/metal; Alaskan operated/QF code share and Alaskan operated and coded, all on one PNR. This is what comes up in MMB (one image; the lines are immediately next to one another).
View attachment 34249


So if something applies to "all flights in your trip" but also applies to "Qantas operated flights only", does it apply to he Alaskan operated and coded leg of the journey?

Over to the experts.

If a TA booked this for you then even if your QFF number is associated with the booking your contact details for that booking will not necessarily be autopopulated. Just like before.

In fact, the contact field(s) sometimes is "prepopulated" with the number of your TA rather than you.

If it's a QF website or call centre booking then no idea why it does that. Though in the process of booking you would have had to fill in those details anyway, but if it didn't carry then still no idea.

As for what that text implies, I'm not sure, though the context isn't clear either. Do you need to make a special request, e.g. dietary meal requirements? Frankly for the latter I would be checking with the partner airline for that rather than relying on the QF website to register it for you (I'd do the same for any airline's booking with multiple partners).

 

[RooFlyer]

If a TA booked this for you then even if your QFF number is associated with the booking your contact details for that booking will not necessarily be autopopulated. Just like before.

In fact, the contact field(s) sometimes is "prepopulated" with the number of your TA rather than you.

If it's a QF website or call centre booking then no idea why it does that. Though in the process of booking you would have had to fill in those details anyway, but if it didn't carry then still no idea.

As for what that text implies, I'm not sure, though the context isn't clear either. Do you need to make a special request, e.g. dietary meal requirements? Frankly for the latter I would be checking with the partner airline for that rather than relying on the QF website to register it for you (I'd do the same for any airline's booking with multiple partners).

I guess I'm wondering why the 'contact details' wouldn't be auto-populated with my Qantas FF contact details. In hundreds of QF flights, including many dozens of international ones, all booked the same, I've never seen this before. Never mind.

The bit I've shown above is underneath where it asks for the contact details; I'm not after any special request, but its fair enough for QF to ask - such as whether I need a bicycle when I land :shock: - which it does. Obviously the kiddies who are the 'amazing IT people' think its perfectly natural to ask if I need a bicycle when I dis-embark at LAX. I'm disappointed there's not an option for a tuk-tuk though. I also see 'Dubai Connect' is not available to me on this trip to North America. That's a disappointment, QF, but thanks for letting me know.

But the context is irrelevant. There are two directly contradictory statement there, one straight after the other. I was thinking it might have something to do with the changing definition of 'flight' , discussed above ? What do you think?

 

[anat0l]

But the context is irrelevant. There are two directly contradictory statement there, one straight after the other. I was thinking it might have something to do with the changing definition of 'flight' , discussed above ? What do you think?

I'd say it's nothing to do with definition of flight. Just the auto-filler elements not talking to each other.

 

[RooFlyer]

I'd say it's nothing to do with definition of flight. Just the auto-filler elements not talking to each other.

OK, good to know. Thank you so much for the insights.

(#3282)

 

[katiebell]

Regarding grouping with next day flights, could this be becuase the definition of "stopover" in relation to an international itinerary is anthing greater than 24 hours?? Per T&Cs:

'Stopover' in relation to:
(a) an Australian domestic Itinerary, means a break of journey at an intermediate point when onward travel does not take place on the same calendar day; and
(b) for all other Itineraries, including those containing a domestic to international connecting flight, means when a passenger arrives at an intermediate point and is not scheduled to depart within 24 hours of arrival;

This would explain why my flight from LHR to Europe is lumped with my flight to London on MMB even though they are not connecting flights and I am spending the night and 22 hours in London.

Even more interesting is that on the 'your bookings' page it lists the flight segment as Aus-LHR. I was a bit concerned when it listed the departure date as Jan 2014 earlier today but is now back to September 2014. Amazing in-house IT team at work?

 

[Happy Trails]

I never cease to be amazed by the QF IT team.

 

[tyrolean]

The 24 hours rule is quite nice for fares: Usually a stopover costs more than a transfer. I love those rules on business trips, where I build complex itineraries in one booking.

 

[Awesom Andy]

I never cease to be amazed by the QF IT team.

Well, they could've chosen words like "excellent", or "very good", but I guess their final choice of wording offer us an opportunity to interpret it as we like.

 

[opusman]

Maybe she was amazed to find out they even had an IT team?

 

[SeatBackForward]

Maybe she was amazed to find out they even had an IT team?

A maze. I think is what was meant.