Malaysian Airlines MH17 Crashes in Ukraine

[browski]

No evidence? What besides confirmed phone call intercepts of people saying they shot down an aircraft in the same area. Satellite imagery of the missile being fired. Lack of another aircraft wreck in the area. Sure nothing confirms the fired missile actually hit MH17. But I don't think we can say there is no evidence.

The items you mention relate who might be responsible if it was a missile.
The investigators are only concerned with how the plane crashed.

Examination of sections of the fuselage (inward explosion or outward explosion) and perhaps information from the black boxes will be the key factors in that task.

The prima facie situation supports a missile strike so it is essential to go after the probable suspects but the important investigative work has not even yet commenced.

 

[burmans]

There is currently no evidence to confirm that MH17 was hit by a missile; but that evidence is rapidly trying to be established by interested parties. If we knew for certain that it was a missile strike then we really don't need the black boxes............but the seasoned investigators know that what is spurted by media and political players may not actually be the truth.

You can be sure that the most senior investigators fully appreciate the gravity of the situation if it is shown that MH17 was not hit by a missile; just pause for a few moments to think of the panic and ramifications of that outcome..............
Let's hope it was indeed a missile strike, but keep an open mind just in case it was not.

Seem to be drawing a long bow to me, we know the missile was there, we know it was fired, we know the commander announced a strike and we know the MH17 is the only plane that seems to have been downed in that area. Sure there is a possibility these events are not linked but not something I'd be putting money on.

 

[NFF]

Where is the transcript between the control tower and the plane ?

 

[markis10]

Where is the transcript between the control tower and the plane ?

Pretty rare for an aircraft to communicate after being hit by a SAM, it's not like the movies, thanks to explosive decompression usually taking out the souls on board in terms of their consciousness.

 

[Jack_OC]

Just watched the PM sign the book of condolences. Anyone know the significance of the flags on display beside it - aside from Australia, as far as I can tell there are the flags of Belgium, Canada, Germany, Singapore (?), Ireland and Malaysia, but no other countries (most notably, no Netherlands flag). Are they countries that the Aussie victims had an association with? I know there was a dual Aussie-Irish citizen on board, so that could be it.

 

[serfty]

The items you mention relate who might be responsible if it was a missile.
The investigators are only concerned with how the plane crashed.

Examination of sections of the fuselage (inward explosion or outward explosion) and perhaps information from the black boxes will be the key factors in that task.

The prima facie situation supports a missile strike so it is essential to go after the probable suspects but the important investigative work has not even yet commenced.

SMH - Photo of MH17 wreckage proves missile attack, claims report

 

[anat0l]

Just watched the PM sign the book of condolences. Anyone know the significance of the flags on display beside it - aside from Australia, as far as I can tell there are the flags of Belgium, Canada, Germany, Singapore (?), Ireland and Malaysia, but no other countries (most notably, no Netherlands flag). Are they countries that the Aussie victims had an association with? I know there was a dual Aussie-Irish citizen on board, so that could be it.

The predominant shots of this conference by the ABC doesn't show the flags set up to the right of the centre (as the audience faces the stage), which includes the Dutch, US, Philippines and a couple of other flags, which collectively I believe reflect the nationalities of the souls on board MH17.

 

[Jack_OC]

The predominant shots of this conference by the ABC doesn't show the flags set up to the right of the centre (as the audience faces the stage), which includes the Dutch, US, Philippines and a couple of other flags, which collectively I believe reflect the nationalities of the souls on board MH17.

Ah, that makes sense. Thanks.

 

[Alanslegal]

I am glad Australia has a seat at the UN Security Council as without it we would have been quite uninfluential in pushing for action/resolution.

Tony Abbott did say when he was in Opposition that he opposed to Labor spending $25M for that UNSC seat bid .... at least we have now made use of it.

 

[NFF]

Pretty rare for an aircraft to communicate after being hit by a SAM, it's not like the movies, thanks to explosive decompression usually taking out the souls on board in terms of their consciousness.

Before communication was cut off.

 

[lovetravellingoz]

Good to see that the remains and black boxes have now been handed over.

 

[markis10]

Before communication was cut off.

I don't think there was anything of note, thanks to Liveatc.net it's all rather open.

 

[legroom]

Just curious

Are civilian airliners capable of knowing it is being targeted (ground radar, homing radar from missiles)?

Alternatively, do they have radars scanning the surroundings to know 'something' is coming?

My 2c says no but I'd defer to more knowledge.

 

[medhead]

The items you mention relate who might be responsible if it was a missile.
The investigators are only concerned with how the plane crashed.

Yes they do related to the question of who, but they relate to how as well. But getting back to your previous post, those items are also confirmed evidence.

 

[medhead]

Just curious

Are civilian airliners capable of knowing it is being targeted (ground radar, homing radar from missiles)?

Alternatively, do they have radars scanning the surroundings to know 'something' is coming?

My 2c says no but I'd defer to more knowledge.

There is a system available. But it's expensive and only really used (in practical terms) for military aircraft. Plus I assume El Al.

 

[alieninperth]

Just watched the PM sign the book of condolences. Anyone know the significance of the flags on display beside it - aside from Australia, as far as I can tell there are the flags of Belgium, Canada, Germany, Singapore (?), Ireland and Malaysia, but no other countries (most notably, no Netherlands flag). Are they countries that the Aussie victims had an association with? I know there was a dual Aussie-Irish citizen on board, so that could be it.

I would imagine that you are right and that the flag represents the countries where the Australian citizens or permanent residents also had citizen-ship.

 

[Denali]

Good to see that the remains and black boxes have now been handed over.

Im thrilled the remains are finally being treated with some common decency.

Im also going to say that I admire the families and friends affected by this. I understand different cultures behave differently but considering some of the hysteric scenes with MH370, how these poor people have been handling the horrible event and aftermath is commendable.

Like all, I just wished such a thing never happened.

 

[drron]

BuzzFeed BennyVerified account ‏@bennyjohnson 6h "Please enjoy listening to all audio that the Kremlin left on these." pic.twitter.com/EfnTGOxFjx

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[drron]

The items you mention relate who might be responsible if it was a missile.
The investigators are only concerned with how the plane crashed.

Examination of sections of the fuselage (inward explosion or outward explosion) and perhaps information from the black boxes will be the key factors in that task.

The prima facie situation supports a missile strike so it is essential to go after the probable suspects but the important investigative work has not even yet commenced.

Please go and read my link to John Kerry's interview.The US has been watching this part of the Ukraine closely for months.have you not seen the satellite photos of military equipment just inside Russia on the nightly news?
So the US saw the the missiles being brought into the area the day MH17 was shot down.They saw the launch and tracked the missile until it hit MH17.Damn good proof if you ask me.
The US also has AWACS operating out of Poland.It is believed that they waited for that data before confirming what they have now said.

 

[juddles]

,.....Im thrilled the remains are finally being treated with some common decency......

Sorry, but i am sick of the assumptions and idealistic drivel that has flourished here (not your post - others!)

This event occurred in the midst of a civil war. A war zone. And in a relatively isolated área.

Even the most advanced and modern/organized country on the planet, the good old USA, would have struggled to manage an event of such huge proportions as this. 300 bodies strewn over a large área. An absolute worst case DVI scenario.

But additionally, the people that are expected to manage the scene are also simultaneously still involved in fighting a war!!

I think it has been amazing the reasonable approach and assistance they have given. They have let CNN crews to the scene for Christ´s sake!!! They could have just denied entry to everyone.

I remain of the opinión it was the ¨rebels¨that downed the plane. But in a mistake of war. With no evil intent.

Humans make mistakes. In an accountants world a mistake means a few zeros are wrong on a balance sheet. In a chef´s world his cake does not rise perfectly. In a soldier´s world innocent people die. Tragic, but just a simple bloody mistake.