Platinum "anytime" lounge Access ceases from 1 February 2011

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Please spare a thought for we business class passengers!

We pay top dollar for our tickets and find that when we get to the lounge, we need to queue behind a bunch of red e-deal platinums to get our slow cooked beef with wild mushrooms.

What is the point of travelling business class if we need to mix with the riff-raff?

Boot them down the hall to the QP! :mrgreen:
 
Please spare a thought for we business class passengers!

We pay top dollar for our tickets and find that when we get to the lounge, we need to queue behind a bunch of red e-deal platinums to get our slow cooked beef with wild mushrooms.

What is the point of travelling business class if we need to mix with the riff-raff?

Boot them down the hall to the QP! :mrgreen:
I'll remember that next time I am travelling business and you are on a Red e-deal :!: :lol:
 
If QF "enhances" our program again in a couple of years, I won't be surprised. You are free to wail and gnash your teeth.
I won't be surprised either. But I still have a right to voice my dissatisfaction at QF's decision making process (if it can be called that) without being called a whinger....

Please spare a thought for we business class passengers!

We pay top dollar for our tickets and find that when we get to the lounge, we need to queue behind a bunch of red e-deal platinums to get our slow cooked beef with wild mushrooms.

What is the point of travelling business class if we need to mix with the riff-raff?

Boot them down the hall to the QP! :mrgreen:
So are you likely to lower your standards to come and say hello to us in the Qantas Lounge? ;)

Personally I prefer the Qantas Lounge to the Business Lounge as there are no DYKWIA's in the Qantas Lounge. :p
 
Hi Everyone,

I’m from Qantas Marketing and wanted to make a few points in regards to the latest changes to Qantas Frequent Flyer and specifically for our Platinum Frequent Flyers.
....

However, we have taken your feedback onboard and are happy to make adjustments to this policy and we’re also pleased to let you know about it first!
From 1 February 2011, to access Qantas Domestic or International lounges, Platinum Members must be travelling the same day on a flight that shows on a Qantas (QF), a Jetstar Airline (Jetstar (JQ), Jetstar Asia (3K) or Valuair (VF)) or a oneworld® flight number on your ticket. Other lounge access conditions apply. See Qantas Club Terms and Conditions.
In doing so, Platinum Frequent Flyers will continue to be welcome to use our lounges to freshen up or whilst waiting for colleagues or friends arriving on other flights. We have also specifically noted Jetstar Asia (3K) and Valuair (VF) as included carriers in the definition.
As you are still lurking here Red Roo, (Last Activity 4th February 2011 05:48 PM), let me put on record that not much of your credibilty / Qantas' is left given this sneaky adjustment to your post above:
From 1 February 2011, to access Qantas Domestic lounges, Platinum Members must be travelling on any flight the same day that shows Qantas (QF), a Jetstar Airline (Jetstar (JQ), Jetstar Asia (3K) or Valuair (VF) or a oneworld® flight number on your ticket. To access Qantas International lounges, a Platinum Member's next onward flight that day must show a Qantas (QF), a Jetstar Airline (Jetstar (JQ), Jetstar Asia (3K), Valuair (VF) or a oneworld® flight number on your ticket. Other lounge access conditions apply
Frequent Flyer - About the Program - Platinum Benefits
I know others have mentioned this prior but I just want to put in on record what I, and many others, think:evil:
 
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As you are still lurking here Red Roo, (Last Activity 4th February 2011 05:48 PM), let me put on record that not much of your credibilty / Qantas'

You know I was reading the announcement of this change of FT the other day. One thing that struck me was Red Roo introduced themselves as a marketing person. It seems to me that it will be extremely difficult to get any useful QFF program feedback from marketing as I seriously doubt they have any decision making ability. (edit: or perhaps, authority over QFF. They just sell the decisions not make or explain them)
 
You know I was reading the announcement of this change of FT the other day. One thing that struck me was Red Roo introduced themselves as a marketing person. It seems to me that it will be extremely difficult to get any useful QFF program feedback from market as I seriously doubt they have any decision making ability.
Why do most CEO's have financial or marketing backgrounds? Either of these groups should not be involved in running a company for various reasons.

I have been having chats with a Qantas staff member in BNE and he (like most Qantas staff I have spoken with) believe that senior management could not make a decision to save their lives and can't wait to see them go.

Problem senior management are still there and Qantas is suffering badly.
 
Personally I prefer the Qantas Lounge to the Business Lounge as there are no DYKWIA's in the Qantas Lounge. :p

I actually don't see anyone in the lounges. I either focus on my colleagues or myself - I pay no attention to anyone else.
 
Please identify the airlines that have been successful with premium only cabins?

The passengers may well be high yielding passengers, but there's not enough of them around.

Hmm - it seems that there is fun in twisting my words around. Did I say anything about having an entire J cabin?

Let me lay it out as I see it, and for those that think they can explain it better, please educate me. :-)

Yield Mangement is simple in principle - it's just complex to implement. By way of analogy: my brother is an actuary. One of their jobs is to provide analysis that shows whether it's possible to have profitable outcomes at what statistical probability. The principle is simple - it's the actual implementation that's complex and hard. Yield Management is about getting the most revenue out of each flight - it's the implementation (e.g. working out how many seats at what prices that's tricky).

In the short run:
- Large capital items (like planes) are relatively fixed. You can't easily swap them around in QF's case (because they aren't on short term lease).
- Each flight has a fixed cost, and a variable cost per passenger. If you can't even cover your fixed costs, you might as well not fly, as each flight is just adding to your loss
- Each pax you put on board should at least cover their variable cost - otherwise each additional pax you are putting on board will add to your loss.
- Each pax that covers their variable cost, provides a "per-pax profit" that can be used to offset the fixed cost of the flight.
- If you get enough "per-pax profit" to cover all your fixed costs for the flight, then you've made a profit
- Fixed costs include flying the plane, plus all the overhead of running an airline (which needs to be apportioned amongst all the flights that the airline has)

Anything wrong with the above analysis?

Next, a $300 fare provides more profit per pax than a $100 fare, all other things being equal (e.g. the class of service). A $300 K class ticket SYD-MEL is much more profitable (the per-pax profit above) than a $100 N class ticket SYD-MEL, because the variable cost in both cases is similar, whilst the revenue is much greater.

In the long run:
- Capital is not fixed. Airlines can buy new planes, get rid of old ones, open new routes, ditch old routes, start up new subsidiaries etc.
- If a route was not profitable using a large aircraft, the airline can sub a smaller one. Or if there is huge demand, they can get a bigger plane
- Unfortunately there isn't a plane that has exactly the number of seats of just J and K class passengers - Boeing hasn't made that model yet, so the airline looks to fill the rest of the seats with cheaper passengers, provided they cover the variable cost of filling those seats.

And in aggregate:
Ultimately how much profit the airline makes is shown in the P&L. Total seats/profit = profit/seat. If total profit is $100m and total seats are 10m, then average profit/seat is $10. That's simple maths. It does mean that the pax on a $300 K class ticket did contribute more to profit than the $100 N class ticket did.

NOTE: I am not saying that QF should give up on the N class tickets. I am saying that the K class ticket is more profitable.

OK: what's wrong with the above? (No responses along the lines of "But what would happen if xyz?" Unless you're prepared to also provide an answer to the question)
 
My 2nd point which I'm going to continue to press is;-

Nobody here as far as I have read, have said that they will fly more with QF because ATA is removed. I've only seen busines move away! BIG loss QF.
 
As a QF shareholder I feel QF should be trying hard to keep the high frequency flyers happy. If this group leave that would hurt QF profitability.
When I was a WP I would never go to the lounge unless I was flying because I did not know about it and even if I had I probably would never have used it.
I have been a Qantas Club life member for about 20 years(probably longer) and Mrscove has been QC Life for almost 18 years.
Now that we travel mostly in J or F we tend to go to the least crowded lounge whichever that one is.
 
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Hmm - it seems that there is fun in twisting my words around. Did I say anything about having an entire J cabin?

Let me lay it out as I see it, and for those that think they can explain it better, please educate me. :-)

Yield Mangement is simple in principle - it's just complex to implement. By way of analogy: my brother is an actuary. One of their jobs is to provide analysis that shows whether it's possible to have profitable outcomes at what statistical probability. The principle is simple - it's the actual implementation that's complex and hard. Yield Management is about getting the most revenue out of each flight - it's the implementation (e.g. working out how many seats at what prices that's tricky).

In the short run:
- Large capital items (like planes) are relatively fixed. You can't easily swap them around in QF's case (because they aren't on short term lease).
- Each flight has a fixed cost, and a variable cost per passenger. If you can't even cover your fixed costs, you might as well not fly, as each flight is just adding to your loss
- Each pax you put on board should at least cover their variable cost - otherwise each additional pax you are putting on board will add to your loss.
- Each pax that covers their variable cost, provides a "per-pax profit" that can be used to offset the fixed cost of the flight.
- If you get enough "per-pax profit" to cover all your fixed costs for the flight, then you've made a profit
- Fixed costs include flying the plane, plus all the overhead of running an airline (which needs to be apportioned amongst all the flights that the airline has)

Anything wrong with the above analysis?

Next, a $300 fare provides more profit per pax than a $100 fare, all other things being equal (e.g. the class of service). A $300 K class ticket SYD-MEL is much more profitable (the per-pax profit above) than a $100 N class ticket SYD-MEL, because the variable cost in both cases is similar, whilst the revenue is much greater.

In the long run:
- Capital is not fixed. Airlines can buy new planes, get rid of old ones, open new routes, ditch old routes, start up new subsidiaries etc.
- If a route was not profitable using a large aircraft, the airline can sub a smaller one. Or if there is huge demand, they can get a bigger plane
- Unfortunately there isn't a plane that has exactly the number of seats of just J and K class passengers - Boeing hasn't made that model yet, so the airline looks to fill the rest of the seats with cheaper passengers, provided they cover the variable cost of filling those seats.

And in aggregate:
Ultimately how much profit the airline makes is shown in the P&L. Total seats/profit = profit/seat. If total profit is $100m and total seats are 10m, then average profit/seat is $10. That's simple maths. It does mean that the pax on a $300 K class ticket did contribute more to profit than the $100 N class ticket did.

NOTE: I am not saying that QF should give up on the N class tickets. I am saying that the K class ticket is more profitable.

OK: what's wrong with the above? (No responses along the lines of "But what would happen if xyz?" Unless you're prepared to also provide an answer to the question)

Without being an expert on the matter - what you say seems to make reasonable sense.

That's said - it's still more profitable for QF to fill empty seats at "almost"
any price, than to fly them empty.

There is not much in the way of additional cost for having some extra bums on seats (meal cost, perhaps slight increase in fuel etc).

Now if you have a WP who flys regularly (in whatever class), then that is one less seat that needs filling. Regardless of what class/fare that WP is taking.

Either way QF is better off if it has those Frequent Flyers actually flying.

And of course no one us arguing the fact that if an airline could fill every seat at F fares - they would.

You should have seen the extortionate fares being charged on the small handful of leftover seats ex-CNS last Tues afternoon/Wed morning!!
Yield management was having a win that day!
 
Well I just fired off an email to QF to have a vent. Let's see what the response is!
 
Well I just fired off an email to QF to have a vent. Let's see what the response is!

What's the e-address? I wanted to send one as well, but gosh they make it to find an e-address from the website as I can't even find one!
 
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