Platinum "anytime" lounge Access ceases from 1 February 2011

[Paddy55]

This is getting very off topic here, it's about any time access not yield management (Which as samiam points out, is snoozeworthy and has been discussed here ad nauseum countless times and all with similar conjecture and argument )

Amen Brothers and Sisters

Paddy

 

[straitman]

Hi,

Variable cost is not my term. It's a well known term in both business and economics. Variable cost - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Variable costs vary as quantity changes (e.g. meals provided vary with the number of passengers). Fixed costs remain the same regardless of the number of passengers (e.g. maintenance required per hour of flying, or pilot's wages)

There is no point selling below variable cost (except perhaps for PR purposes - e.g. a loss leader). If you can not cover variable costs, your business will fail in the short run, because each additional passenger you add will lose you more money - it's better *not* to have any passengers.

If you can cover variable cost in the short run, but not your fixed costs, then you will fail in the long run. That's Economics (and business) 101.

To remain viable, both variable and fixed costs need to be covered.

My last comment on the topic which is actually off topic.

I have no disagreement with you on how fixed costs and variable costs work and I fully appreciate what you are saying.

However what I am saying is from aviation industry knowledge and experience versus theory.

I have written business plans for airlines and it is common to sell tickets at below cost so at least to have some income from that perishable commodity. A small income is better than no income.

What we are talking here is taking the basic economics 101 model and moving it up a few levels to where every commodity (seat) is analysed and tweaked to ensure maximum return on every occasion.

 

[simongr]

I cut out a bit of your post as you have covered the situation well. To answer your questions, yes scanning the QFF card does get a shopper docket at the gate in ADL.

Is NGCI live in MEL now? I have been using the NGCI card exclusively since I received it - and using it all ports.

 

[Sequel]

Is NGCI live in MEL now?

It wasn't when I went though today.

 

[drewbles]

Is NGCI live in MEL now? I have been using the NGCI card exclusively since I received it - and using it all ports.

It wasn't when I went though today.

No it's not, but seeing as you can do OLCI (barcode) and Mobile check-in (also barcode), the gate readers (with barcode readers) will read the back of your FF card (barcode) as well.

It's not actually documented anywhere on the QFF site that I can see, but it definitely works (thanks to others on here mentioning it, it's how I travel now. Nice easy way of doing it when combined with OLCI. Note you need to be checked in for this to work though.

 

[medhead]

No it's not, but seeing as you can do OLCI (barcode) and Mobile check-in (also barcode), the gate readers (with barcode readers) will read the back of your FF card (barcode) as well.

It's not actually documented anywhere on the QFF site that I can see, but it definitely works (thanks to others on here mentioning it, it's how I travel now. Nice easy way of doing it when combined with OLCI. Note you need to be checked in for this to work though.

Documented in the FAQ for NGCI. I'm on the phone now but there is a link in the thread somewhere. Last question in the FAQ tab "New Qantas Card"

 

[samiam]

Documented in the FAQ for NGCI. I'm on the phone now but there is a link in the thread somewhere. Last question in the FAQ tab "New Qantas Card"

Can I use mobile or online to check in, then use my card as the boarding pass at the gate?

Yes. You can choose to check-in by any of the check-in methods available to you and then use your Qantas card to board the aircraft. This includes ports not equipped with Next Generation Check-in technology.

 

[Dnicoll]

Tried out post-1 Feb anytime access at the Sydney T2 Qantas club today, which was a strange and annoying experience.

I fly out early on Rex (as no early QantasLink flight is scheduled) and back on QantasLink once a fortnight, so the anytime access is useful to me (and of benefit to Qantas, as in return I fly international business exclusively with Qantas to keep the platinum).

Arrived and showed my FF card, and upon request produced my (Rex) boarding pass. Was informed that I could only enter the club if I was flying Qantas on the next flight. I told the doorman that I was entitled to enter if flying on Qantas anytime that day according to the email I received. He immediately said "I'm sorry, I don't know my job, please come in".

I questioned him about the rules again, as I don't want to be having this discussion at 5.50am every fortnight, but he had nothing more to say and just asked me to come in.

To be honest it made me very annoyed (despite him not arguing with me) - the rules say I can enter, and I felt embarassed (if not humiliated) to stand at the door and beg. It would have been worse if my colleague was with me requesting guest access (thankfully they turned up late).

I guess I will come with a printout of the rules next time, but do wish that they trained their staff about the rules. Alternatiively, if they want to take away anytime access then that's fine and I will buy a rex (inferior) lounge access and fly international business with someone else. Just don't humuiliate the "highly valued" platinum customers!

 

[awilcockson]

Was informed that I could only enter the club if I was flying Qantas on the next flight. I told the doorman that I was entitled to enter if flying on Qantas anytime that day according to the email I received.

Now don't get me wrong, I am a very vocal opponent of the removal of ATA ... But ...

From my reading of the new rules, I don't believe you were entitle to lounge access. To get access you would have either needed to be departing on QF on your next flight, or have just arrived on QF. I don't believe your return flight on QF later that day actually qualifies you for entry in the morning before your Rex departure.

 

[drewbles]

Now don't get me wrong, I am a very vocal opponent of the removal of ATA ... But ...

From my reading of the new rules, I don't believe you were entitle to lounge access. To get access you would have either needed to be departing on QF on your next flight, or have just arrived on QF. I don't believe your return flight on QF later that day actually qualifies you for entry in the morning before your Rex departure.

From Frequent Flyer - About the Program - Platinum Benefits

¶ From 1 February 2011, to access Qantas Domestic lounges, Platinum Members must be travelling on any flight the same day that shows Qantas (QF), a Jetstar Airline (Jetstar (JQ), Jetstar Asia (3K) or Valuair (VF) or a oneworld® flight number on your ticket. To access Qantas International lounges, a Platinum Member's next onward flight that day must show a Qantas (QF), a Jetstar Airline (Jetstar (JQ), Jetstar Asia (3K), Valuair (VF) or a oneworld® flight number on your ticket. Other lounge access conditions apply.

(my bolding)

As long as the flight was that day, Dnicoll was absolutely permitted by that as it was 'Same Day'. Onward only applies to International, and even then, that particular rule differs from the announced rules (And I intend to keep my print out of the notification of changes as that says the same for international as the above does for domestic, ie, same day, meaning you could use the J lounge when using any carrier, providing you arrived on QF).

 

[Danger]

Sadly, it's hardly a surprise that lounge staff don't know the rules. And while it's completely fare to assume they should, imagine how hard it must be to keep up with all the rules and terms and conditions and the plethora of footnotes.

 

[JohnPhelan]

Was informed that I could only enter the club if I was flying Qantas on the next flight. I told the doorman that I was entitled to enter if flying on Qantas anytime that day according to the email I received. He immediately said "I'm sorry, I don't know my job, please come in".

To be honest it made me very annoyed (despite him not arguing with me) - the rules say I can enter, and I felt embarassed (if not humiliated) to stand at the door and beg.

To be honest, I think you're being overly-dramatic about the whole thing. The man didn't argue with you; when you pointed out what the new rules said he invited you to enter. OK, he made a mistake the first time, but fixed that. You did not "stand at the door and beg". You pointed out his error (no doubt in a pleasant and business-like way) and he then let you in, as he should.

How you can say that made you feel embarrassed or humiliated, I have no idea ..........

 

[awilcockson]

As long as the flight was that day, Dnicoll was absolutely permitted by that as it was 'Same Day'. Onward only applies to International, and even then, that particular rule differs from the announced rules (And I intend to keep my print out of the notification of changes as that says the same for international as the above does for domestic, ie, same day, meaning you could use the J lounge when using any carrier, providing you arrived on QF).

well there you go, shows how confusing these new rules are. I thought I had a handle on them, but obviously I was wrong. Thanks for the correction though, very handy to know.

 

[serfty]

To be honest, I think you're being overly-dramatic about the whole thing. The man didn't argue with you; when you pointed out what the new rules said he invited you to enter. OK, he made a mistake the first time, but fixed that. You did not "stand at the door and beg". You pointed out his error (no doubt in a pleasant and business-like way) and he then let you in, as he should.

How you can say that made you feel embarrassed or humiliated, I have no idea ..........

I can fully understand Dnicoll's issue - I get the impression the agent with "I'm sorry, I don't know my job, please come in", was not indicating they had been wrong; it was more they could not be bothered arguing still believing Dnicoll was not entitled to access.

I too would have endeavoured to nicely enlighten the agent in regard to the rules.

(At the very least it is possible the Agent realised they had made a mistake, but were not going to apologise.)

 

[Alanslegal]

To be honest, I think you're being overly-dramatic about the whole thing. The man didn't argue with you; when you pointed out what the new rules said he invited you to enter. OK, he made a mistake the first time, but fixed that. You did not "stand at the door and beg". You pointed out his error (no doubt in a pleasant and business-like way) and he then let you in, as he should.

How you can say that made you feel embarrassed or humiliated, I have no idea ..........

Regardless of being embarassaed or humiliated everyone has different reactions. Some small and some large, we're all different.

However removal of ATA is a negative for QF, they are and will lose business because of this. Even a simple case like Dnicoll who earns QFWP by flying premium cabins internationally is tempted to move their business elsewhere - all because of ATA removal.

 

[GCC]

I flew in to CBR yesterday on QF and arranged to have a meeting in the J lounge on arrival
Showed my WP card and was asked for my boarding pass. Explained I had come SYD and the card was my BP. Was asked for my card and it was scanned.
Was asked if I was aware of changes to lounge access rules, and said yes. Was told I needed an onward flight. Looked a little amazed, and was then told I could access the lounge "this time" as it was at the dragon's discretion. I wasn't going to argue the point with a new business contact standing next to me, but:
1) clearly QF staff don't know the rules and /or are confused by them
2) it was a little embarrassing under the circumstances - I'm not at all sensitive but when doing business it is just not a good look.

 

[Princess Fiona]

Ok now I'm worried, I think it's time to crank up the printer and carry the T&C's with me at all times

 

[awilcockson]

I wasn't going to argue the point with a new business contact standing next to me, but:
1) clearly QF staff don't know the rules and /or are confused by them
2) it was a little embarrassing under the circumstances - I'm not at all sensitive but when doing business it is just not a good look.

I would have gone back and had a word with the dragon after your business contact had departed ...

 

[oz_mark]

Sadly, it's hardly a surprise that lounge staff don't know the rules. And while it's completely fare to assume they should, imagine how hard it must be to keep up with all the rules and terms and conditions and the plethora of footnotes.

It's also another thing about how the rules were explained to the staff. I have seen training material in another company that had some mismatches with actual regulations.

I think the intent of the change was to allow arrivals access - but the wording allows a more general usage. I suspect the staff may have been told the intent.

 

[awilcockson]

I think the intent of the change was to allow arrivals access - but the wording allows a more general usage. I suspect the staff may have been told the intent.

That was my understanding as well, although as has now been pointed out to me the wording definitely implies otherwise (and in our favour). Probably won't be long before the wording is "enhanced" further to rule out doubt.