Predictions of when international flights may resume/bans lifted

[oznflfan]

Scomo needs to be careful here. He was on ''opening up'' road a few months ago but now pandering to conservatives by stating Fortress Australia and COVID ZERO (that is for election purposes) but separate to that he needs carrots and incentives encouraging vaccinations.

He DOES need as many vaccinated as possible, and needs various carrots do do that. He won't go heavy on coercion tactics until after the election though (he probably wins).

We need him to state something like if you are fully vaccinated, once safe to exit Australia and Biosecurity lifted, you can visit countries using a framework for Smartraveller - Green/Yellow/Orange/Red.

Green - NZ
Yellow - Israel
Orange - Malaysia
Red - India

THIS IS THE IMPORTANT BIT - I want his to state if all goes to plan and when safe to open borders, and to safe countries*, he will allow home quarantine for ** days and testing required for each colour.

He won't list what clarification for safe countries are as this goes against COVID ZERO though. Anything above 1 is too much before an election. Answer will be purposely vague. It will come out black & white after the election though.

 

[Pom-DownUnder]

Interesting video on vaccine risk, i've watched a bunch from this guy very informative doctor who keeps his opinion out of it and goes through facts intelligently.

 

[oznflfan]

BAD NEWS:

Home Affairs boss Michael Pezzullo has confirmed there will be no significant reopening of the international border before June 2022, but says discussions about travel bubbles with Singapore and Pacific countries are still a possibility before then.

GOOD NEWS:

Appearing at a Senate estimates hearing this morning, Mr Pezzullo also confirmed work is underway on establishing a new “Digital Passenger Declaration” which will include information about a person’s health and vaccination status. He said the declaration could mean Australians won’t have to quarantine on return to the country if they have been vaccinated in Australia. The Home Affairs secretary said the current border arrangements were “not sustainable” once international travel was properly re-introduced.

 

[dajop]

GOOD NEWS:

Appearing at a Senate estimates hearing this morning, Mr Pezzullo also confirmed work is underway on establishing a new “Digital Passenger Declaration” which will include information about a person’s health and vaccination status. He said the declaration could mean Australians won’t have to quarantine on return to the country if they have been vaccinated in Australia. The Home Affairs secretary said the current border arrangements were “not sustainable” once international travel was properly re-introduced.

I hope there is a degree of reciprocity with this. If overseas vaccinations are not recognised, then some overseas Australians (yours truly included) are seriously going to look at getting vaccinated for a second time in Australia, if it means avoiding 2 weeks quarantine + $3K + caps on returning to Australia. Some countries have government apps where you verify vaccination status, so as to not rely on potentially fraudulent pieces of paper (my vaccination status can be retrieved from 2 government apps).

 

[Pom-DownUnder]

BAD NEWS:

Home Affairs boss Michael Pezzullo has confirmed there will be no significant reopening of the international border before June 2022, but says discussions about travel bubbles with Singapore and Pacific countries are still a possibility before then.

GOOD NEWS:

Appearing at a Senate estimates hearing this morning, Mr Pezzullo also confirmed work is underway on establishing a new “Digital Passenger Declaration” which will include information about a person’s health and vaccination status. He said the declaration could mean Australians won’t have to quarantine on return to the country if they have been vaccinated in Australia. The Home Affairs secretary said the current border arrangements were “not sustainable” once international travel was properly re-introduced.

the article you link doesnt mention Pezzullo at all ?

 

[SydneySwan]

Mr Pezzullo also confirmed work is underway on establishing a new “Digital Passenger Declaration” which will include information about a person’s health and vaccination status. He said the declaration could mean Australians won’t have to quarantine on return to the country if they have been vaccinated in Australia.

This is unbelievably small-minded. I hope a more mature approach is taken. It would be staggering if I travelled to the UK and my AZ vaccination was not recognised considering the vaccine was developed there. Most Aussies in the UK have been vaccinated already. Are we seriously going to not recognise this and ask them to revaccinate when in Australia?

 

[dajop]

This is unbelievably small-minded. I hope a more mature approach is taken. It would be staggering if I travelled to the UK and my AZ vaccination was not recognised considering the vaccine was developed there.

I suspect it is not the vaccine that is the problem, but the integrity of the documentation verifying that an individual has been vaccinated (with an acceptable vaccine). Electronic verification on official apps are probably the only way to go - otherwise fraudulent vaccine papers will be available for $100 a pop (or created at home for free - I've looked at my paper vaccination documentation, I could probably whip up an exact replica up in 15 mins).

 

[JB expat]

BAD NEWS:

Home Affairs boss Michael Pezzullo has confirmed there will be no significant reopening of the international border before June 2022, but says discussions about travel bubbles with Singapore and Pacific countries are still a possibility before then.

GOOD NEWS:

Appearing at a Senate estimates hearing this morning, Mr Pezzullo also confirmed work is underway on establishing a new “Digital Passenger Declaration” which will include information about a person’s health and vaccination status. He said the declaration could mean Australians won’t have to quarantine on return to the country if they have been vaccinated in Australia. The Home Affairs secretary said the current border arrangements were “not sustainable” once international travel was properly re-introduced.

This time frame is depressing. If (big "if", but go with it for a minute)- as per yesterday's Age - there will be sufficient Pfizer in Australia to have everyone vaccinated by Dec 2021. Making everyone who takes the vaccine fully vaccinated by mid-Jan 2022, why the June date? Seems random and makes no sense.

Another question that I raised at home. I wonder if - as a condition to home quarantine - they will insist that all members of the household who are eligible be vaccinated too even if they aren't travelling.

 

[Pom-DownUnder]

whole thing is absolutely depressing

 

[burmans]

I suspect it is not the vaccine that is the problem, but the integrity of the documentation verifying that an individual has been vaccinated (with an acceptable vaccine). Electronic verification on official apps are probably the only way to go - otherwise fraudulent vaccine papers will be available for $100 a pop (or created at home for free - I've looked at my paper vaccination documentation, I could probably whip up an exact replica up in 15 mins).

Hey I’ve got an idea, let’s have a mutually recognised document, say something like a vaccination passport!

 

[mviy]

Another question that I raised at home. I wonder if - as a condition to home quarantine - they will insist that all members of the household who are eligible be vaccinated too even if they aren't travelling.

That can be solved by staying at a holiday house (obviously only open to some people) or potentially renting out an AirBNB for an extended period if there are members of the household that haven't been able to be vaccinated yet.

 

[dajop]

Hey I’ve got an idea, let’s have a mutually recognised document, say something like a vaccination passport!

Hopefully governments will get on board ...

IATA Travel Pass Initiative

The Travel Pass App developed during the COVID-19 pandemic has now been decommissioned.

www.iata.org

 

[oznflfan]

This time frame is depressing. If (big "if", but go with it for a minute)- as per yesterday's Age - there will be sufficient Pfizer in Australia to have everyone vaccinated by Dec 2021. Making everyone who takes the vaccine fully vaccinated by mid-Jan 2022, why the June date? Seems random and makes no sense.

Another question that I raised at home. I wonder if - as a condition to home quarantine - they will insist that all members of the household who are eligible be vaccinated too even if they aren't travelling.

Because they know vaccinations won't be complete by Christmas, and best case scenario by mid 2022. This date gives them breathing space.

(I know we are not UK, but as comparison) UK for example allows home quarantine for individuals in family units. Let's say I go to French F1 GP by myself, I can home quarantine in my home with wife and four kids if I stay in a room and have bathroom facilities private to me for the 10? days ( I actually have this ability). If I need to leave the room I wear a face mask and stand more than 6 feet away from my family. No hugs at airport when you get back.

 

[burmans]

whole thing is absolutely depressing

I'm not as depressed as some about this, we all know how fast the Prime Minister can turn when News papers start turning on him, we saw this recently with the India ban.

We've seen some evidence of this already on border controls and people starting to speak out, in my view while there will be setbacks the news out of Europe will be more and more about them opening up and these stories will inevitably increase and start to get peoples attention.

I think we fail to realise how fast opinion can turn here.

 

[Pom-DownUnder]

I'm not as depressed as some about this, we all know how fast the Prime Minister can turn when News papers start turning on him, we saw this recently with the India ban.

We've seen some evidence of this already on border controls and people starting to speak out, in my view while there will be setbacks the news out of Europe will be more and more about them opening up and these stories will inevitably increase and start to get peoples attention.

I think we feel to realise how fast opinion can turn here.

agree and i think the heat will get turned up when t he rest of the world is respecting the freedom of their populace and we still arent, but ultimately the lack of drive of the populace en masse to have a plan a schedule, a mission rather than to sit in a cave is what gets to me

 

[JB expat]

agree and i think the heat will get turned up when t he rest of the world is respecting the freedom of their populace and we still arent, but ultimately the lack of drive of the populace en masse to have a plan a schedule, a mission rather than to sit in a cave is what gets to me

Agree- the general acceptance of the current situation is so frustrating. I'm not saying "just open" at all costs - but the majority just don't care that much.

 

[dajop]

but the majority just don't care that much.

I think the majority do care a lot - about keeping the borders shut. The PM is not going to go against that sentiment until it changes.

 

[JB expat]

I think the majority do care a lot - about keeping the borders shut. The PM is not going to go against that sentiment until it changes.

Yes, but consequences be damned - because the borders are irrelevant to their lives.

 

[Pom-DownUnder]

I think the majority do care a lot - about keeping the borders shut. The PM is not going to go against that sentiment until it changes.

yea the idea that everyone is pulling together and in it as a nation, i just dont feel it, feels alot more self-absorbed than that, making me very homesick which i havent felt in a decade and causing some big think

 

[oznflfan]

dajop said:

I think the majority do care a lot - about keeping the borders shut. The PM is not going to go against that sentiment until it changes.

Yes, but consequences be damned - because the borders are irrelevant to their lives.

It'll be relevant when they can't feed themselves, schools closing, police reduction, public servant jobs halved, then please help us.