RedQ or Red Herring?

[oz_mark]

Maybe the QF asia idea is being dumped for some kind of JV with MAS?

I think the powers that be, studied AFF carefully and realised narrow body aircraft weren't going to cut it. They'll be back with a bigger, better and wider RedQ :mrgreen:

 

[TonyHancock]

Not everyone is stupid.

I am, and I have a certificate to prove it!

So long as you dont disagree with the naz_s that think they own AFF or the senior members that think their opinion is somehow 'more' valid.

I think that is a little harsh, there are a lot of passionate members who are not frightened to express their views.

As for me, I'm waiting on something a little more official before I wade in with my usual asinine views! It does all seem a little odd though.

 

[simongr]

So long as you dont disagree with the naz_s that think they own AFF or the senior members that think their opinion is somehow 'more' valid.

And finally the thread can be closed now that someone has invoked Godwins Law.

 

[browski]

Maybe the Mods should move this post to a new thread, but this document is well worth a read from Tony Webber who was Qantas Group general manager microeconomics and then chief economist between 2004 and April 2011. (NB: John Phelan, best you don't read this article, because Tony Webber has not read the RedQ plans, so his opinion should be ignored.)

The quandaries facing Qantas | Tony Webber

In his summary he states: "The main difficulty, however, is that its decision-making mindset is focused on its competitors outside its own backyard. I’m convinced that its announcement today, and its profit announcements down the track, would improve if it dropped this focus of its efforts and shifted attention to its home market."

Well what would this radical tree-lovin' hippy comrade know, anyway?

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[simongr]

It is interesting that QF state that the majority of their profits arise from their domestic business and this person thinks that they should focus on improving profit in the domestic market. Home market might mean competitors ex-Oz but that was part of the strategy for the asia based airline.

 

[Justchecking]

Well, I for one will be thankful that this idea is now off the list of things QF will do in 2012. Maybe now they can turn their attention to aircraft interiors currently decorated in an avante garde fashion with duct tape. and I do agree with a post some pages back stating they should get on with refreshing the QF brand (wherever in the world it currently flys).

 

[amaroo]

Option 1: Analyse those facts that are publicly available and subject them to rigorous analysis and interpretation.
Option 2: Ignore the publicly available information and simply assume that Alan Joyce knows what he doing.

Can i suggest that option 2 is the one that strains credibility here?

You've pricked my interest - you write with what appears to be much authority & knowledge of the airline business. If you don't mind.....I'm interested in understanding how many airlines you have created or managed.

If you do take exception to the question - I apologise in advance & will debate some options with myself:-

Option 1 : Maybe you are indeed are highly experienced airline executive that has created & managed a still trading, flying & profitable business - you're comfortable with your stage in life & not one to boast about your achievements.

Option 2 : Maybe you have an incredible chip on your shoulder or shoulders - something has happened & since then you are only capable of seeing red when others just see a red roo on the tail.

I hope it's option 1 but feel it's more in line with options 2.

 

[777]

You've pricked my interest - you write with what appears to be much authority & knowledge of the airline business. If you don't mind.....I'm interested in understanding how many airlines you have created or managed.

If you do take exception to the question - I apologise in advance & will debate some options with myself:-

Option 1 : Maybe you are indeed are highly experienced airline executive that has created & managed a still trading, flying & profitable business - you're comfortable with your stage in life & not one to boast about your achievements.

Option 2 : Maybe you have an incredible chip on your shoulder or shoulders - something has happened & since then you are only capable of seeing red when other just see a red roo on the tail.

I hope it's option 1 but feel it's more in line with options 2.

Hmm. Unnecessarily personal response. Perhaps i am simply pointing to obvious problems with the publicly available information about this plan?

You don't seem to be actually refuting the logic of my point which is essentially: the logic of starting an airline where you have not yet determined where it will be based implies that the plan is not well developed or fully thought through. Do you disagree? If you disagree, why?

Surely we can debate that point without trying to change the subject or suggesting that i am claiming insight that i am not claiming.

 

[browski]

You've pricked my interest - you write with what appears to be much authority & knowledge of the airline business. If you don't mind.....I'm interested in understanding how many airlines you have created or managed.

Amaroo, do you need to have had a broken leg to know that it hurts? Just stick to the text, and don't play the man. The whole discussion board is powered by second-guessing decisions/motives.

 

[amaroo]

Hmm. Unnecessarily personal response.

Well, I see you like to take aim at AJ - whats the difference?

 

[JohnK]

Was it wrong to think that RedQ was going to be a failure without seeing any business plans? I guess we will never know.

Glad to see this chapter of QF history over. Let's hope Qantas management acquire the skills to run an airline while they still have an airline to manage....

 

[TonyHancock]

Let's hope Qantas management acquire the skills to run an airline while they still have an airline to manage....

....or alternatively Qantas shareholders acquire the board and management needed to run an airline while they still have an airline to manage...

 

[777]

Well, I see you like to take aim at AJ - whats the difference?

I am critiquing his management decisions and the direction he is taking Qantas in. I think he is doing his job poorly and in that context i am questioning the viability of his strategy for Qantas. I am arguing that evidence from his performance to date makes me not confident that he will achieve his publicly stated aims and that those aims appear to be confused. You seem to be personally criticising a guy on an internet forum as a means of changing the subject and avoiding actually discussing the issue at hand.

Now, do you actually disagree with my argument? If so, why?

 

[ajw373]

Option 2 : Maybe you have an incredible chip on your shoulder or shoulders - something has happened & since then you are only capable of seeing red when other just see a red roo on the tail.

I vote for option 2, judging by his/her user name. Maybe the fact that Qantas has never ordered the 777 may have something to do with it. Very common gripe that one.

 

[777]

Was it wrong to think that RedQ was going to be a failure without seeing any business plans? I guess we will never know.

Just to be clear, according to AJ today RedQ is still going and has not been cancelled. If it had been he would be obliged to notify the ASX and he hasnt done so.

Simple question but who actually believes that this new airline is going ahead?

 

[Flying Fox]

And now here comes the reverse story -

Qantas denies plans to shelve Asian hub

"Nothing has changed in relation to our plans. We still believe we have to have an Asian alternative for our core customer base," he told BusinessDay. "We are still looking at setting up a premium airline in Asia. We are still talking to the Singaporeans and the Malaysians and when we have a more definitive decision about what we are going to do ... and who the partners are ... we will inform the market."

 

[777]

I vote for option 2, judging by his/her user name. Maybe the fact that Qantas has never ordered the 777 may have something to do with it. Very common gripe that one.

Or maybe you're all just massively over analysing it! I really have no idea whether Qantas should have ordered the 777 and in any case that decision was made years before current management got there.

 

[777]

Agree totally - maybe we should start with culling posts by the VA fanbois

Or maybe you could try just staying on topic and argue the issues at hand. I am genuinely trying to ask you why you disagree? Is it too much to ask that you simply answer that and stop changing the subject?

 

[ajw373]

Now, do you actually disagree with my argument? If so, why?

I shall bite and say I disagree. None of us have any idea what so ever what was planned, what is planned and how far advanced those plans are. That alone is enough to rebuke the claims that the plans were ill conceived etc.

Futher Joyce like him or hate him is the CEO of a multi billion dollar business that operataes in an incredibly competitive and politically driven industry that is seriously up the creek and must adapt and change to meet the changing operating environment. Yet we have a group of people, staff, commentators and some passengers who want things to remain like they were in the 90's, despite the fact that the 90's have long been left behind. The future for Qantas is to compete with the likes of Emirates, not in their back yard which is more or less Europe but in ours, read Asia. Qantas choose the wrong alliance partners years ago and has a massive hole so close to home so needs to tap that market. How are they gonna do it?

 

[browski]

Agree totally - maybe we should start with culling posts by the VA fanbois

No, it's not a happy comment, Amaroo. Personal attacks and other distractions are not acceptable when trying to prosecute a line of argument. Sometimes it is just better not to post and just let it go through to the keeper.