Surely it is now now time to change lounge access rules

[TonyHancock]

I really won't have time to give a proper reply to this for a few days.

Can I save you the hassle of the proper reply by just agreeing now with whatever it might be?

Whilst pedantry is something I have been accused of in the past the medicine* seems to have kicked in so probably it is best for me to avoid the debate. I have a real concern that I will refer to "wanker" Platinums as the great unwashed!!!! (I wonder which is worse?)

* Read Chateau Dan Murphy's Claret for medicine!!

 

[simongr]

Hi Tony

As medhead points out I think you have set out a reasonable argument about why P1s should be treated differently - and they are in fact already.

What you haven't done is request that other pax have a downgrade in benefits and denigrate those other pax - that is where I see a difference in attitude.

It is this point that is I think the nub of the problem:

I do find it frustrating when I can't access WP benefits because of overcrowding, and I would like to think that QF would try to ensure P1's do get priority over those that have not reached that level. Am I being selfish and a DYKWIA. Yep you bet....but no more so than many of the WP's who post here on AFF. The vast majority of posters here seem to want to maximise the benefits granted with status....and why not?

Personally I haven't suffered overcrowding in the SYD F lounge (again I won't debate the SIN lounge as we know that it has been poor for some time, has been made more poor and has an uncertain future) but I will defer to your more extensive experience.

The problem is how to fix it. feper has suggested limiting access to only F, CL and P1. This is a pretty blunt tool. Given that QFF stated at the AFF lunch that they were targetting "about" 3,000 P1s and best estimates of the number of WP in total is 60,000 - if we didnt allow WP access to the F lounge then the lounge would be empty and an empty lounge is oft soon to become a closed lounge.

I assume QF know about the over crowding issue as they would have pretty good visibility of how many people checked into the lounge at all times so let's hope they are thinking about this.

 

[medhead]

Can I save you the hassle of the proper reply by just agreeing now with whatever it might be?

Whilst pedantry is something I have been accused of in the past the medicine* seems to have kicked in so probably it is best for me to avoid the debate. I have a real concern that I will refer to "wanker" Platinums as the great unwashed!!!! (I wonder which is worse?)

* Read Chateau Dan Murphy's Claret for medicine!!

No need to just agree with me. Fortunately simongr has basically outlined my thoughts. The only thing I would add is that you (P1s) do get those other extra, unwritten benefits that you referred to; I would suggest they are a way of addressing the question of priority over lessor platinums.


Sent from the Throne

 

[simongr]

One might also consider the additional benefits of P1 (front row whY domestically) as compensation for the overcrowding in the lounges.

 

[MatF]

I don't have the time or inclination to read this entire thread (I've only browsed through this thread to get the main themes :shock, so please forgive me if this question has already been asked ...

Q for Feper: If we wound back the clock to not so long ago, before P1 existed, would you be suggesting F lounge access should be restricted to F pax and CL only? Interested to hear your view.


(probably also worth reiterating that, as we know, P1 isn't another level of membership - it provides additional benefits for some within the WP level).

 

[TonyHancock]

What you haven't done is request that other pax have a downgrade in benefits and denigrate those other pax - that is where I see a difference in attitude.......

.......The problem is how to fix it. feper has suggested limiting access to only F, CL and P1. This is a pretty blunt tool. Given that QFF stated at the AFF lunch that they were targetting "about" 3,000 P1s and best estimates of the number of WP in total is 60,000 - if we didnt allow WP access to the F lounge then the lounge would be empty and an empty lounge is oft soon to become a closed lounge.

Now to repeat myself... My proposal is to create a " true " first lounge, access restricted to passengers in F, CL and P1.
the WP and J and OWE are in another, and QP OWS and Gold in another, and yes stop the double SC.

I think Feper was suggesting a "more exclusive" lounge over and above the current F lounge. I agree post one in this thread was not the best start but his argument evolved to the creation of an additional lounge. Is this reasonable? Personally I'm not sure. It seems QF would have to maintain the F lounge name for it's WP's here on AFF, as we have seen in this thread - The WP's are revolting!!

I don't have an answer, but I am strongly opposed to the double SC offers, although I understand the commercial reasoning behind them. So I think Feper and I are not that far apart in what we are looking for. So I guess it is only a matter of time before I get to experience the wrath of the AFF WP's!!!

Incidentally the SIN F lounge on Saturday was a standing room only zoo....for some. (Whilst QF doesn't have it's own lounge in FRA the JAL F lounge is a bizarre example of two post WWII industrial giants combining to create a third world experience!!)

One might also consider the additional benefits of P1 (front row whY domestically) as compensation for the overcrowding in the lounges.

I tend to fly DJ J domestically so whilst it is a benefit it is not one that resonates greatly with me. (I do occasionally get to fly Y so I do accept that it is not a bad benefit for many.)

 

[Alanslegal]

Q for Feper: If we wound back the clock to not so long ago, before P1 existed, would you be suggesting F lounge access should be restricted to F pax and CL only? Interested to hear your view.

I would be interested in Feper's points of views too .... <redacted>

 

[lovestotravel]

(probably also worth reiterating that, as we know, P1 isn't another level of membership - it provides additional benefits for some within the WP level).

Ah okay just wanted to make sure that was clear

 

[MatF]

Ah okay just wanted to make sure that was clear

Roger that

 

[samh004]

I think Feper was suggesting a "more exclusive" lounge over and above the current F lounge. I agree post one in this thread was not the best start but his argument evolved to the creation of an additional lounge. Is this reasonable? Personally I'm not sure. It seems QF would have to maintain the F lounge name for it's WP's here on AFF, as we have seen in this thread - The WP's are revolting!!

So I think Feper and I are not that far apart in what we are looking for. So I guess it is only a matter of time before I get to experience the wrath of the AFF WP's!!!

I agree with Feper in his idea that a proper First lounge needs to be created, new and separate to the current First lounge, or a lounge within a lounge concept, however I disagree with him that a proper lounge would get access based on extremely high status. Then it's technically not a proper lounge anymore, and just a dream for him.

Ideally internationally you'd have:

• Business Lounge
  • J pax, F pax
  • QP, SG, WP, P1, CL, CLP1
• First Lounge
  • F pax
  • WP, P1, CL, CLP1
• First Room
  • F pax

If anything, beyond that you might give CL members access as they're not an earned tier, but just someone you'd like to look after. But I'm sorry, just because you fly a whole lot, but aren't important enough to be given CL membership, doesn't entitle you to be in the "First Room".

One might also consider the additional benefits of P1 (front row whY domestically) as compensation for the overcrowding in the lounges.

I don't fly Mainline much, but when I do I'm almost always in the front row of Y. The most recent time when I wasn't was when I was upgraded. That said, I can't preselect like you can

 

[anat0l]

I agree with Feper in his idea that a proper First lounge needs to be created, new and separate to the current First lounge, or a lounge within a lounge concept, however I disagree with him that a proper lounge would get access based on extremely high status. Then it's technically not a proper lounge anymore, and just a dream for him.

Ideally internationally you'd have:

• Business Lounge
  • J pax, F pax
  • QP, SG, WP, P1, CL, CLP1
• First Lounge
  • F pax
  • WP, P1, CL, CLP1
• First Room
  • F pax

If anything, beyond that you might give CL members access as they're not an earned tier, but just someone you'd like to look after. But I'm sorry, just because you fly a whole lot, but aren't important enough to be given CL membership, doesn't entitle you to be in the "First Room".

To be honest, CLs have their own lounge, which is supposed to be as good as the FL, so what are they doing here? (Maybe there's no spa in the CL).

If anything, give P1s the ability to reserve spa appointments, seats at the restaurant, book the office suites in advance.... I think that's a fair additional benefit for P1s (F pax can reserve a spa appointment in advance - this should be maintained) and goes a great way to solving the OP's problem.

 

[Ewing]

To be honest, CLs have their own lounge, which is supposed to be as good as the FL, so what are they doing here? (Maybe there's no spa in the CL).

CL is domestic only.

 

[simongr]

To be honest, CLs have their own lounge, which is supposed to be as good as the FL, so what are they doing here? (Maybe there's no spa in the CL).

There is no CL for int'l flights.

 

[drewbles]

For me a lounge is not a place to "have an experience" or see how much cheap champagne I can guzzle, it is my office, my dining room and my bathroom, travel as much as I do and yes these things are important to keep me and my business on top of things, so yes I do expect to be able to utilise these facilitys; sure it may be a first world "problem" but then the whole idea of a lounge is a first world experience, so please stop throwing in that line.

As previously mentioned it's not a 'First Class' Lounge, it's the "First" lounge.

If you're using the lounge as your office, perhaps you'd be better off in the "Business" Lounge, as Businesses are usually linked to Offices more than First is

 

[drewbles]

CL is not achievable by any amount of flying.

There is at least one AFF'er on that has CL due to personal spend on QF (albeit it a sum that's so huge it's a case of 'if you have to ask you can't afford').

 

[harvyk]

There is at least one AFF'er on that has CL due to personal spend on QF (albeit it a sum that's so huge it's a case of 'if you have to ask you can't afford').

I do believe the amount is around the $2 million mark. He always flies F (or J if F is unavailable), and I believe he always has his PA fly with him in the same class.

 

[freepyjamas]

Clearly, the only way forward is for all users of the F lounge to wear badges, and be served accordingly.

F's:
UNLIKE YOU STATUS coughS, I ACTUALLY PAID TO GET IN HERE TODAY.

P1's:
I FLY MORE MILES THAN ANYONE IN HERE. BOW BEFORE ME.

WP's:
I'M JUST HAPPY TO BE HERE.

CL's:
COMPARED TO WHAT I'M USED TO, THIS PLACE IS NOTHING.

 

[drewbles]

I do believe the amount is around the $2 million mark. He always flies F (or J if F is unavailable), and I believe he always has his PA fly with him in the same class.

Yup, but proves the point the non-famous, non-political, non-travel-budget-influencing amongst us can 'buy' our way into the club, even if it's an absurdly high amount like BR spends with QF (and it's a moot point as they only ever fly the highest available cabin).

 

[simongr]

Yup, but proves the point the non-famous, non-political, non-travel-budget-influencing amongst us can 'buy' our way into the club, even if it's an absurdly high amount like BR spends with QF (and it's a moot point as they only ever fly the highest available cabin).

I thought the magic figure for getting CL was control over $1million of QF spend.

 

[medhead]

I think Feper was suggesting a "more exclusive" lounge over and above the current F lounge. I agree post one in this thread was not the best start but his argument evolved to the creation of an additional lounge. Is this reasonable? Personally I'm not sure. It seems QF would have to maintain the F lounge name for it's WP's here on AFF, as we have seen in this thread - The WP's are revolting!!

I don't think the post history you quoted supports that conclusion. The OP in this thread clearly stated a suggestion to remove benefits. A few posts by others modified that to the idea of creating a new lounge. The OP then claimed those modifications as their idea and claimed they were repeating their idea. The problem is that wasn't a repeat/restatement. It was a completely new suggestion.

They have then gone on to attack a number of people on the basis that they were suggesting a new lounge when that was clearly not the suggestion in the OP.


Sent from the Throne