The 6:30am BNE-SYD is gone and I am not on it [No ESTA]

[Princess Fiona]

Johnk has already said he made a mistake, time to move on and say "Mia culpa", getting an ESTA on the day of travel should never happen as you should check visa requirements when you book, which includes checking you have a valid ESTA for USA travel. If you make a mistake just say "Mia culpa" take the cost and move on.

It's "mea culpa" but yes I agree

 

[RooFlyer]

Is there a list on here of visa requirements for each country? Think it's time we had a info thread to refer to for all countries to help all in future..... I know Google but would be a neat AFF feature to have?

Good point.

One here. (ps I don't recommend using Toll, even as a secure/trackable Passport courier. Terribly expensive!)

There used to be a page on the Star Alliance web site that also gave visa requirements, but they have moved it. I'll post it when I find it.

Edit: I think its gone. Even the Loyalty Lobby link doesn't find it any more.

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Is there a list on here of visa requirements for each country? Think it's time we had a info thread to refer to for all countries to help all in future..... I know Google but would be a neat AFF feature to have?

There is a visa and immigration forum on AFF. Also some good wiki pages on world wide visa requirements.

Given the complexities of visas, transits without visa, visas of arrival, visa requirements that can change simply if you arrive and depart from different cities in a country, x10 or 20 (if we were to just consider the main nationalities on AFF) and it would be a huge undertaking.

TIMATIC (available through a number of sources, free of charge) is the best way of confirming entry requirements. Follow this up with the relevant embassy or consulate site for the country you want to go to.

 

[opusman]

It's "mea culpa" but yes I agree

Mama mea!

 

[gwilli1]

God I wish I had got some popcorn before reading this thread

 

[MEL_Traveller]

Good point.

One here.

There used to be a page on the Star Alliance web site that also gave visa requirements, but they have moved it. I'll post it when I find it.

And that link is, unfortunately, a perfect example of where information is not complete.

if you have a look at China (clicking the country takes you to a detailed info page) it tells you a visa is required. There is no mention anywhere of transit without visa which is available for up to 6 days depending on your circumstances - meaning you don't in fact need to go through the application process.

 

[farstar]

yes Mea culpa

 

[serfty]

Re: BNE-SYD-LAX-BNE VA Y US$266 on Orbitz [gone]

No. The contract is between the passenger and the airline. Orbitz is an agent of the airline.

By definition an agent is not a party to a contract. Rather they are a conduit to connect the other parties.

There is some presumption here.

Not withstanding that the OP failed to arrive at the airport with a valid ESTA, VA devolves check-in time notification to the agent. As such the agent is indeed considered a party to the contract!

See this the from the CoC:

10. Check-in

10.1 Domestic and International Short Haul
...

10.2 International Long Haul

(a) You must check in to board the flight at our check-in facility serving the place of departure. You will be advised of the check-in time for your flights in your Itinerary and/or by your Authorised Agent.

 

[RooFlyer]

And that link is, unfortunately, a perfect example of where information is not complete.

if you have a look at China (clicking the country takes you to a detailed info page) it tells you a visa is required. There is no mention anywhere of transit without visa which is available for up to 6 days depending on your circumstances - meaning you don't in fact need to go through the application process.

Fair enough! My comment about not using Toll (added as an edit after your post) can be extended to their site in general!

 

[boomy]

Sorry to hear about your experience this morning JohnK. It was bad luck and can happen to anyone.

During the busy lives we are leading it's easy to overlook the obvious sometimes. Reminds me my first trip to mainland China where I took care of everything in advance but forgot about the visa. Luckily someone told me about that the day before so sill had time to apply for a costly last minute visa but it could easily end up in tragedy.

Regarding what Virgin could or couldn't have done better, I don't know their system enough to comment but I can speak from my experience and say both Qantas & Emirates opened up flights when arrived after check in closed. If they can I wonder why VA can't...
I hope the VA rep on AFF (if there is one) will shed some light on why they couldn't reopen check-in 10 minutes past for one of their status pax who was forced to miss an overseas connection because of that.

I'm disappointed to read so many negative comments in this thread. The OP had a bad day and felt the need to rant about it so either write something supportive or move on to the next thread.

 

[HeavyElectricity]

Re: BNE-SYD-LAX-BNE VA Y US$266 on Orbitz [gone]

Virgin are to blame. Waited too long in international check-in queue while someone was rearranging luggage and then would not check me into domestic flight.

Whilst you do have my sympathy - we all make mistakes, I do think trying to blame others is a little out of order. Try to think of these scenarios from other peoples views as well - maybe there were also people in the queue behind yourself that was cursing the person at the check-in counter for taking a long time because they didn't have an ESTA?

 

[kpc]

Sorry to hear about your experience this morning JohnK. It was bad luck and can happen to anyone.

During the busy lives we are leading it's easy to overlook the obvious sometimes. Reminds me my first trip to mainland China where I took care of everything in advance but forgot about the visa. Luckily someone told me about that the day before so sill had time to apply for a costly last minute visa but it could easily end up in tragedy.

Regarding what Virgin could or couldn't have done better, I don't know their system enough to comment but I can speak from my experience and say both Qantas & Emirates opened up flights when arrived after check in closed. If they can I wonder why VA can't...
I hope the VA rep on AFF (if there is one) will shed some light on why they couldn't reopen check-in 10 minutes past for one of their status pax who was forced to miss an overseas connection because of that.

I'm disappointed to read so many negative comments in this thread. The OP had a bad day and felt the need to rant about it so either write something supportive or move on to the next thread.

Nicely put boomy esp. the last paragraph. ..I just don't understand the negativity towards John here and on the other forum where I have also expressed my disappointment! In fact, I'm going to take a time out from all my online travel forums, and reassess the degree of my participation!

 

[BettyB]

Re: BNE-SYD-LAX-BNE VA Y US$266 on Orbitz [gone]

Not wanting to be rude but how does one not know the visa/entry requirements of a country long before you turn up to the airport? It's pretty much the first thing I do before I book anything.

Too true. It's basic travel 101. Something that you should attend to weeks before in a planned trip. To think that there would not be any formalities for travel to anywhere other than NZ is mind blowing.

 

[TheInsider]

Just my input now.

This situation is cough and completly avoidable. Yes the OP didn't do the right thing and didn't have an ESTA, but the way in which virgin delt with this is just unacceptable.

Virgin can open the flight and check him in.
Virgin can move the flight to the next one without any hassle or charges what so ever.
Virgin can only check-in one sector if needed.
Virgin could've stepped up and offered to help with the situation. (this isn't the first time and won't be the last).
No matter what was paid, the passenger expects the same service as a full fare ticket, so that is NOT an excuse.
Virgin issuing the boarding pass for just the domestic sector wouldn't have any issue with getting the OP back to the original airport if esta didn't approve. It's a domestic flight, no requirements for these flights.

 

[clifford]

Nicely put boomy esp. the last paragraph. ..I just don't understand the negativity towards John here and on the other forum where I have also expressed my disappointment! In fact, I'm going to take a time out from all my online travel forums, and reassess the degree of my participation!

This sounds like an attempt at a little censorship in respect of a favoured son. How about we all try and be objective. Let us be able call a spade a spade without fear or favour. Isn't that what this forum is about?

And I do feel sympathy for john, as I almost ended up in the same situation once. Just happened to have more time to do the online application.

 

[mel-world]

All I want to say is 'thank goodness for my travel agent', who I have used for around 30 years now. All the Apps in the world might make life easier for busy executives on the run but a quiet nudge from my TA has made sure I have not forgotten a Visa or had to scramble last minute.

Sorry they can't stop me sleeping in though.

 

[RooFlyer]

Just my input now.

This situation is cough and completly avoidable. Yes the OP didn't do the right thing and didn't have an ESTA, but the way in which virgin delt with this is just unacceptable.

Virgin can open the flight and check him in.
Virgin can move the flight to the next one without any hassle or charges what so ever.
Virgin can only check-in one sector if needed.
Virgin could've stepped up and offered to help with the situation. (this isn't the first time and won't be the last).
No matter what was paid, the passenger expects the same service as a full fare ticket, so that is NOT an excuse.
Virgin issuing the boarding pass for just the domestic sector wouldn't have any issue with getting the OP back to the original airport if esta didn't approve. It's a domestic flight, no requirements for these flights.

As 'the Insider' I've seen your insightful observations elsewhere about airline operations, and have appreciated them.

So, are you saying from an authoritative and personal knowledge point of view that:

* In Australia, you can be allowed to check in on the domestic sector of an international flight that is to the USA, without an ESTA? The computer will allow it?
* You can be short checked to the departure port (without an ESTA) without being checked through to the international leg?
* What is the process of re-opening a flight (who says what to whom... who has the say?) and at what point does it become 'un-openable' for late arrivals (ie pax's own fault, not an emergency etc)

... genuine questions. If you can add certainty to those issues, we'll all be better informed.

But if not, then saying Virgin 'can' do this and that is moot. The passenger 'can' be organised as well. In your opinion, how long after a flight is closed do you think its reasonable for it to be re-opened for a passenger who hasn't complied with flight documentation in time? At what point do all those who have arrived on time etc ceased to be inconvenienced for the one who is disorganised?

I'm sorry to those others on this thread who I also respect who don't like the so-called negativity expressed. But the thread opened up with some pretty negative and I think unjustified comments about the airline (of which I'm no routine defender!!), so I think it was always going to be a bit of an arm wrestle. I like a rant against an airline as much as the next person, but I don't think I've had one where the source of the problem was me and if I did, I think I might be a bit more self-depreciatory.

 

[mannej]

This sounds like an attempt at a little censorship in respect of a favoured son. How about we all try and be objective. Let us be able call a spade a spade without fear or favour. Isn't that what this forum is about?

And I do feel sympathy for john, as I almost ended up in the same situation once. Just happened to have more time to do the online application.

Fair call, however I think what kpc is advocating is that members should play the ball and not the man. It is all fair and well to say that there haven't been any personal attacks, but the OP may not perceive it that way. I think the OP is a little raw, and has also had this thread posted onto a Facebook group which he has no access to, so he isn't able to defend the personal attacks.

JohnK can definitely polarise members on the forum, however as you rightly mention we are all human and can have things slip our minds. Who knows what JohnK has had going on in the background, as he has hinted at this holiday being a release.

Yes not having the ESTA was the first (and main) error here, but it isn't as if VA can learn a thing from the experience.

 

[Aussie_flyer]

No the next flight to Sydney was below minimum connect time so no that was not an option.

 

[Aussie_flyer]

How was this a holiday? JohnK was doing a same day return to Los Angeles and back. That's no holiday. Its torture.